We're on the road to ruin.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012:10:28:17:50:23 by Wildwillie .

Sums it up exactly, WW. If we're looking to 'spread the word' the pitch-side effort blew it massively. I looked at today as a nice afternoon spent with mates and there was also a rugby match going on! Don't think we'll be getting many new supporters from the York area!

Miserati - and Proud to be!

Official attendance of 820 ish. Of these about 18 (from Jersey) were delighted, 600 were depressed & the rest will be thinking that York could do no worse than Leeds in the Championship!

Meaningless competition is the main problem. Still doesn't absolve what sounds like a flakey performance.

Quote:

Wildwillie
Official attendance of 820 ish. Of these about 18 (from Jersey) were delighted, 600 were depressed & the rest will be thinking that York could do no worse than Leeds in the Championship!

Not sure how they got a number today- I didn't show my ticket to anyone. Did hear a rumour that Sian was walking around counting though

If we're treating it as a meaningless competition and we're on the road then charge admission accordingly...£5 adults, kids free.

Miserati - and Proud to be!

Quote:

Mark_C
If we're treating it as a meaningless competition and we're on the road then charge admission accordingly...£5 adults, kids free.

According to all the interviews we are treating this competition very seriously, and going 'on the road' is a PR exercise. Given that, did anybody see our esteemed PR manager at the game today? I ask because he certainly didn't do the post match interview with DE, and IF he wasn't there, what does that tell you?????????

COME ON LEEDS.
We've been through it all together.

I think there are a couple of issues going on at once here

1. The purpose of the 'on the road' games. There is one reason and one reason only for the 'on the road' games and that is because the pitch at HC is being replaced. This is being spun as an excellent opportunity to take the show on the road and gain a few more fans (possibly laying the foundations for regionalisation) which of course, it is. However, instead of keeping the rotation to a minimum and playing to win, Diccon has put the second string out and payed the price, squandering an excellent opportunity by trying to have his cake and eat it.

2. The performance against Jersey. Jersey are a championship club on merit, Leeds are a championship club on merit. If one of the Championship clubs fields very close to their first team and the other fields the second string with no recognised fly half then it should be fairly easy to predict which team is going to win. The days of us fielding a second string and rolling over championship sides are, for the time being, behind us and anyone who thinks otherwise is , frankly, deluded.
Having said that, I think we need to apply a little perspective to yesterdays result. Even with a second string and a poor performance, we werent too far away from winning yesterday. In my opinion there were two main reasons why we didn't. Firstly, indiscipline combined with the excellent kicking of Mike Le Borgeois and secondly our lack of a recognised fly half as, when we did manage to keep the ball in hand, we looked capable of scoring at will. With better discipline and if Fordy had played I believe we would have won yesterday even with half a team.
The blame for the indiscipline and our lack of a back up fly half lies, once again, with DE.

DE is the common denominator. In a previous post JDH asked whether Diccon was the man to take the club forward and came to the conclusion that he wasn't. I have to say that I agree. Tn my opinion the club made some excellent decisions this summer but they dodged the big one and we are now paying the price.

Couple of points:-

1. Accepting what a fine player he is I don't think the lack of Wee Stevie made any difference. If your front 5 get dominated most of the afternoon (excepting lineout) and don't produce any quality ball then you might as well have my aunty nellie stood out in the backs. Must be very frustrating for those who came in wanting to make an impression. Also, the Jersey game plan very cleverly didn't include any kicking to our back 3 allowing them to counter attack. They simply attacked, ball in hand, 10 yards either side of the ruck hitting space and some fairly passive tackling in that area.

2. The main problem here is a lack of second tier competition. When we were in the A League fringe players got regular tough competition keeping them sharp and ready for when the call to the first team came. With nothing to keep fringe players sharp (excepting those on loan) it's a very tough call to step straight into competition as it normally takes 2 or 3 games to get full match fitness. Why can there not be a Championship A League or at least a Divisionalised A League including the 3 Yorkshire teams plus Bedford, Nottingham and Moseley for starters. That would be 12 "reserve" games per season. Just a thought.

Good post LT.

One point on the pitch. I've heard GH quoted as being doubly delighted by the Rhinos Grand Final win because it's a financial beano too and he reckons it pays for the pitch. It means they get all the Grand Final rewards AND the revenue from World Club Challenge again.

What, if any, difference that makes to us I don't know, but it seems good for the Rhinos who probably need to freshen up a brilliant but old squad. At the very least we will get a good surface. If we ever manage to get it out to the backs they are looking quick this year.

Thank you Rhinos for paying for the new pitch construction! Given that the Rhinos play in the warmer half of the year it is Carnegie who will get the bulk of the benefit from the undersoil heating and the revamped drainage.

Or does the Rhino's Boxing day fixture pull in more cash than our fixtures?

I wasn't born in Yorkshire but I got here as soon as I could

leeming is correct - the common denominator is DE

On the performances i have seen from leeds since DE took charge i see the same basic mistakes, poor discipline, inconsistency and faliure to execute at critical times. That teamed with only having 1 flyhalf says DE isnt up to the job. Admitting he had a complete mare last year and leading the review into his own failing leaves him in the job

Look back over the post match reactions over the time he has been here. I would bet they are nearly the same word for word. so what has been achieved?

where does Geech come into play? I know he said his role was mainly in getting new investment but why cannot he review leeds like he has england?

What do you think they're burying under the Headingley pitch....???

BWWWOOOOAAARRRGGGHHH!!!

Miserati - and Proud to be!

I made the mistake (now corrected) of following the first team players on twitter to get some insight into affairs in the cauldron.

Nay, they swap tweets of highly amusing photos of each other not being highly amusing at all.

Not a word about rugby let alone Carnegie.

Deeply disappointed.

I swallow all my optimistic words about being pleased with having home grown youngsters making up the squad, they are not only not good enough, they don't seem to care. They seem to prefer X factor to fronting up of a weekend.

Start again MK IV next season.

Slightly unfair Knavesmire , they are all young lads and twitter is where they share banter. It would be far more depressing if they did discuss the game on such an open forum.

Knavesmire,

After all the angry and bitter tweets about DE that were rife from players at the end of last season I would imagine the players have been told that twitter is out of bounds for anything rugby.

As you suggest, Leeds may not be good enough, but none the less, we do have some very good players and I can't believe that most of them don't care. If only to escape Leeds at some point in the future, they have to care about their own performance and the team achievement.

Quote:

williamwebbellis
Knavesmire,
After all the angry and bitter tweets about DE that were rife from players at the end of last season I would imagine the players have been told that twitter is out of bounds for anything rugby.

As you suggest, Leeds may not be good enough, but none the less, we do have some very good players and I can't believe that most of them don't care. If only to escape Leeds at some point in the future, they have to care about their own performance and the team achievement.

Absolutely,

In fact my motivation for writing my post above was that if nothing is done we will lose this very talented bunch of players to other clubs and their potential will be fulfilled there rather than at Leeds.

I think our biggest battle this season will come, not on the rugby pitch, but during the next close season when we have to make sure we hang on to them for an all out assault on promotion next season.

Lions led by a donkey!

Now with a few snaps that I took at the game. The third one was taken 3 seconds after Jamel had scored - by which time he was halfway back down the pitch!

Quote:

leemingtyke

Quote:

williamwebbellis
Knavesmire,
After all the angry and bitter tweets about DE that were rife from players at the end of last season I would imagine the players have been told that twitter is out of bounds for anything rugby.

As you suggest, Leeds may not be good enough, but none the less, we do have some very good players and I can't believe that most of them don't care. If only to escape Leeds at some point in the future, they have to care about their own performance and the team achievement.

Absolutely,

In fact my motivation for writing my post above was that if nothing is done we will lose this very talented bunch of players to other clubs and their potential will be fulfilled there rather than at Leeds.

I think our biggest battle this season will come, not on the rugby pitch, but during the next close season when we have to make sure we hang on to them for an all out assault on promotion next season.

Lions led by a donkey!

Still confident after listening to the post match interviews sir?

Some good players yes, good Leeds players, not convinced.

Let's start again with players who want to play for Leeds and not just have a job.

I feel your pain Knavesmire.

But,

Last season, we had a team of good and very good players including more than a smattering of experienced ex-prem players... which by his own admission Edwards couldn't manage.

He made a big deal about choosing his own squad, choosing players carefully, players with the right skills, potential and attitude. Personally, I think he did choose some good players, however, they still aren't performing to their skills and potential.

Why would I come to the conclusion that we have a cr*p set of players...so lets get some different ones in for Edwards to play with?

Unfortunately I don't know if there's any of us that know the parameters that Diccon's been given to put out a side.

Miserati - and Proud to be!

Sorry Mark, but I don't understand what you mean?

Budgets, objectives, plans for the future etc.

I would really like to think that there is a plan to regroup and get back to the Premiership, but I'd like like this to be spelled out to supporters by the board. I'd hope that they are men of integrity, and that they wouldn't be hanging DE out to dry.

Miserati - and Proud to be!

Agree Mark...whats the plan?...do we have one....lets have a bit of clarity...spell it out...surely there cant be any state secrets about what we are doing wrong...not now? Have the fans become an optional extra? Went to see Selby play on sat..saw some great direct straight powerful runs... worth about 20 points?

Quote:

Mark_C
Budgets, objectives, plans for the future etc.
I would really like to think that there is a plan to regroup and get back to the Premiership, but I'd like like this to be spelled out to supporters by the board. I'd hope that they are men of integrity, and that they wouldn't be hanging DE out to dry.

Edwards is not stupid and that’s for sure, I'll be surprised if he lets anyone at Leeds hang him out to dry

He should never have been in the job. He was a coach without the right experience or skills for the task and that led to the succession of bad of management moves that played out last season. It seems to me that he is still struggling.

All that said, I think the fact that his contract wasn’t terminated last season, and the family jewels were sold without a fight tells me that GH has no appetite for a serious challenge for the premiership... but will that admission leave his lips…I seriously doubt it.

I would like to see how GH 'ringfences' the £5 million it received for the sale of the shares to Exeter. I'd like to think that it may be invested in the the Leeds Rugby Foundation, who will be allowed to keep the interest from those share - less any money taken to buy new players for Leeds Carnegie.

Miserati - and Proud to be!

I wouldn't hold your breath on that one Mark, although what do I know.

I remember you and I realising at the end of the 10/11 season that Leeds were planning to settle down as a championship side for the foreseeable future. I don't think anything has changed since then, other than our hopes for some good rugby are yet to materialise on a regular basis.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012:10:28:19:16:18 by williamwebbellis.

I'm no expert on charity law, but I suspect that if you were to chuck £5M in it might be quite difficult to get it back out if we were to need it.

[quote Knavesmire][quote leemingtyke][quote williamwebbellis]
Still confident after listening to the post match interviews sir?

Some good players yes, good Leeds players, not convinced.

Let's start again with players who want to play for Leeds and not just have a job.[/quote]

Cant really comment on the post match interviews because I havent seen them and cant find them on the offy, however, in answer to your question, Yes - I'm still confident that we have a very talented group of players who are desperately in need of competent management. Maybe not quite a Golden Generation but a very talented group which we are very lucky to have and whose potential is being wasted by inept managment.

Diccon has made some good additions to the squad, particularly Green, Myerscough and J Doc, but anyone can pick out good individuals. His job is to build a winning team and imho he is completeley incapable of doing this due mainly to his complete and utter lack of any man management ability whatsoever.

I firmly believe that this squad under Geech would be a force to be reckoned with.

The thing that i dont get from DE is confidence. Pre match, post match, i dont get a feeling that things are going to change.

I hope he proves me wrong and i hope the players get there heads on. young though he is jacob has got to get a grip of this team and get them fired up because for me they are reverting back to being labelled with the "soft" tag NB battled to get rid of.

Interesting little piece in this weekends Wharfedale match programme.
According to the programme editor - and I've no reason to doubt him - Leeds Carnegie do not receive a penny for taking the game against Moseley up t'dale.
All admission receipts, programme sales (which Leeds will print and pay for) and bar takings are kept by the host club. I assume that this is the case at the other "on the road matches"
If this is indeed the case we are going to lose a tidy sum.
Can anyone shed further light on this bombshell !!!

Obviously Inside Pass, the club can. Whether they choose to do so in public is another matter.

COME ON LEEDS.
We've been through it all together.

If it means that we don't have to pay for the use of their facilities then this doesn't seem unreasonable and gives the host club an incentive to drum up local support. I would hope that we're getting a hefty discount on the charge we pay to the Rhinos for using Headingley.

Nice road trip

Regarding twitter....... Club life is about banter, stealing each others phones and changing phone numbers in the contacts so that the girl you are pursuing is actually one of the boys.....

I can't imagine that .... Would say anything interesting apart from about eating the the Loose head or landing a cheeky punch that the ref did not see!