PLAYING FOR PRIDE
Bayliss: fine form
By PG Tips
February 16 2021
The suspension of relegation transforms Friday’s west country clash from demolition derby to a matter of pride. Bath and Gloucester are two of only four clubs never to have dropped out of the top flight since competitive leagues were introduced 32 years ago. Last week’s RFU announcement means that they can breath easy about their Premiership status for another season. Will this be a meaningless tie as a result, or can these two struggling clubs dish up a feast befitting their pedigree?
Of the four ever presents (Leicester and Wasps are the others), Gloucester are the only one not to have won a domestic League title or the Top European trophy. Their supporters comfort themselves whenever they enjoy a superior season to their west country rivals. A double over Bath is as highly prized as a Premiership trophy would be. Having pushed Premiership leaders Bristol all the way last Friday, scoring three tries to two and losing only to a late penalty, they will feel ready to heap further humiliation on the Blue, Black & White. They will know how Bath hustled Sale into error and expect their pack, with Garvey at its core to fare better, their experienced back row of Gibson, Ludlow and Clark to be an antidote to the raiding of Bath’s younger trio.
Losing only Johnny May to England, the Cherry and Whites still had three on international duty last weekend. With Puma Santiago Carreras and Ollie Thorley bagging their three tries, they have an interesting choice on the wings- which of these to leave out to make way for Wales’ hero Louis Rees-Zammit? With Chris Harris of Scotland a likely returner, whoever is chosen should see plenty of ball. They are blessed at scrum half too, where Heinz and Simpson may deny Italian cap Varney a place even on the bench. They will though rue the absence through injury of Jake Polledri, one of the hardest carriers and toughest tacklers in the league.
Bath will feel lifted not only by victory at Sale last Friday, but by the manner of the win. It is too early to talk of turning a corner but that performance spoke loudly of pride, passion and unity. It also proved the value of heads up rugby and attacking intent. Will the lack of relegation lead to meaningless matches? Possibly, but not on Friday. West Country bragging rights should see to that. Besides, this is only Round 10. With over half of Premiership fixtures to go, Bath are only 8 points off the top European pace. Gloucester too will feel they can make up lost ground with a late season surge. Both teams will take heart from their three try performances last Friday and hope to go one better for bonus points against old rivals.
Who will Bath select? There is much to be said for continuity and building on last week’s result. Some will argue that with survival assured Bath should give meaningful game time to newly signed and developing players. I certainly hope to see more of Du Toit, Green, Schoeman, Bailey, Ojomoh, Muir and Gray before season’s end. For this match I would like Du Toit, Schoeman and Gray to play significant parts from the bench. The only 6 Nations returnee would be Taulupe Faletau. I would have him on the bench to reward the togetherness and form of last Friday’s loose trio and so he enters the fray feisty and fired up.
Bath have shown glimpses of what they can do this season- mainly away. What better time than a home derby to pull a performance from pride? Bath must give this all the passion it deserves and find not just a derby triumph but a launchpad for revival.
Possible Teams:
Bath: Schoeman, Dunn, Judge, McNally, Williams, Bayliss, Reid, Mercer. Spencer, Priestland. Muir, Matavesi, Joseph, Rokodoguni. De Glanville.
Replacements: Bhatti, Du Toit, Thomas, Staddon,Faletau. Green, Schoeman, Gray.
Gloucester:
Ruskin, Walker, Balmain, Garvey, Alemanno, Gibson, Ludlow, Clark. Heinz, Twelvetrees. Thorley, Atkinson, Harris, R-Zammitt. Woodward.
Replacements: Socino, Seville, Ford-Robinson, Craig, Morgan.Simpson, Kveseladze, Carreras
PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Comeonmylovers.co.uk (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 09:45
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Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:24:18:15:18 by P G Tips.
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Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:24:18:15:18 by P G Tips.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 09:47
Quote:Comeonmylovers.co.uk
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R.Zammit and TF surely won't play this weekend after their 6N camps will they?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:16:09:49:14 by BathMatt53.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 09:56
The Premiership agreement dows not apply to Wales.
Maybe Wales have agreed a permanent “camp buble” like England - but I have seen no announcement.
PG
Maybe Wales have agreed a permanent “camp buble” like England - but I have seen no announcement.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: dragonfly (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 10:29
Quote:They will be sent back to their clubs; whether the clubs choose to play them is up to them.P G Tips
The Premiership agreement dows not apply to Wales.
Maybe Wales have agreed a permanent “camp buble” like England - but I have seen no announcement.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 10:38
I wouldn't - let TF have a rest and keep the faith in the young lads IMO.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: OutsideBath (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 10:49
Quote:BathMatt53
I wouldn't - let TF have a rest and keep the faith in the young lads IMO.
+1
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 10:55
I'd have TF on the bench. I get the feeling that the young lads (Staddon and Richards), who sat on the bench at Sale and started the Quins game would've gained a lot from the experience but they're a little way off being completely ready for Prem rugby, which is no surprise given they're 18.
As PG surmises, this game is just about pride, but win and we'd be moving back up the table. 30 minutes of TF from the bench would be useful. Perhaps either Ellis or Spencer (W) might be back too.
And as PG suggests, I'd put JJ back in at 13. He owes the squad a good shift. If he's disappointed about not being in EJ's squad, then he needs to stop moping around and show it on the pitch. Shame the weather doesn't look good, but JJ playing in a side that threw it around as much as we did last week when we had the ball (admittedly not often) should enjoy himself.
As PG surmises, this game is just about pride, but win and we'd be moving back up the table. 30 minutes of TF from the bench would be useful. Perhaps either Ellis or Spencer (W) might be back too.
And as PG suggests, I'd put JJ back in at 13. He owes the squad a good shift. If he's disappointed about not being in EJ's squad, then he needs to stop moping around and show it on the pitch. Shame the weather doesn't look good, but JJ playing in a side that threw it around as much as we did last week when we had the ball (admittedly not often) should enjoy himself.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Bath Supporter Jack (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 10:57
I think TF is improving as he plays more.....bear in mind he only played for Bath for 17 minutes in the past three years
How good would it be to be THERE!!
How good would it be to be THERE!!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Never In Doubt (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 12:19
It would be great to call on Stooke but sadly I think he has made that impossible for Bath.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 12:50
NID
His ban covers the next match.
PG
His ban covers the next match.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 13:17
Stooke is up before Magistrates tomorrow. He may, of course, be found not guilty.
If he is found guilty I would be very surprised if we ever see him in a Bath shirt again.
If he is found guilty I would be very surprised if we ever see him in a Bath shirt again.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: woodpecker (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 13:30
Until last weeks game I would have thought Glos would win this, they weren't great but I could see what they were trying to do. Now I have no idea.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 16/02/2021 20:05
Ellis may be back in the mix. Handy option given we have had two 18 yr olds in the 23 last few weekends. They look v good but best used in the cup this season.
Think I would rest faletau. He is class but no need to put our internationals through extra games, better off learning more about the other options.
Think I would rest faletau. He is class but no need to put our internationals through extra games, better off learning more about the other options.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Never In Doubt (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 08:33
Ellis would be a very helpful addition .... think Reid and Bayliss are going to need a bolster at some stage. Hats off to them they have become leaders by deed at a young age and in a crisis.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Awp (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 08:39
Quote:malco
Stooke is up before Magistrates tomorrow. He may, of course, be found not guilty.
If he is found guilty I would be very surprised if we ever see him in a Bath shirt again.
He wouldn’t be found not guilty tomorrow. As i assume it’s his first appearance he would either plead guilty or elect for trial at a later date.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 09:16
Quote:Awp24975Quote:malco
Stooke is up before Magistrates tomorrow. He may, of course, be found not guilty.
If he is found guilty I would be very surprised if we ever see him in a Bath shirt again.
He wouldn’t be found not guilty tomorrow. As i assume it’s his first appearance he would either plead guilty or elect for trial at a later date.
If he pleads guilty, which you would imagine is likely, he will be dealt with immediately.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Rawce (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 10:02
I dunno, Hoops’ words in the Chron Injury update sounded fairly conciliatory but that could have been Hoops not giving anything away. If we did get behind him it might indicate where his future lies.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: dcsh (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 10:06
Quote:If he is fit I would definitely include him in the squad, probably on the bench. Firstly to have a bit more experience and power to call on, but secondly because he seems to have played so little for Bath in his time here and at this point he actually looks to be coming into form, so why let Wales be the only ones to benefit.charlieboa
Think I would rest faletau. He is class but no need to put our internationals through extra games, better off learning more about the other options.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 10:09
Quote:dcshQuote:If he is fit I would definitely include him in the squad, probably on the bench. Firstly to have a bit more experience and power to call on, but secondly because he seems to have played so little for Bath in his time here and at this point he actually looks to be coming into form, so why let Wales be the only ones to benefit.charlieboa
Think I would rest faletau. He is class but no need to put our internationals through extra games, better off learning more about the other options.
No idea if this is true but it is an impression I have as well!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Awp (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 10:58
Quote:malcoQuote:Awp24975Quote:malco
Stooke is up before Magistrates tomorrow. He may, of course, be found not guilty.
If he is found guilty I would be very surprised if we ever see him in a Bath shirt again.
He wouldn’t be found not guilty tomorrow. As i assume it’s his first appearance he would either plead guilty or elect for trial at a later date.
If he pleads guilty, which you would imagine is likely, he will be dealt with immediately.
Exactly, which is what I would imagine due to the time it has taken to get to court.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Bath Supporter Jack (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 11:00
dcsh + 350,000 per year!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 12:51
I'm happy if Faletau sits this one out. If Mercer/Bayliss/Read are good to go, then they can carry on the good work. I also think that squeezing the pips out of your international players is counter-productive on various levels. What they are paid is irrelevant - they are paid that amount because that's the market rate. If we look after Taulupe and help him be at his best when representing his country, I'm sure the feelings will be mutual. Also - why is there that underlying resentment about players playing for their country? We should celebrate that, support it and be pleased about it in the same way that the player's own family would be. Country is more important than Club.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 12:54
Quote:dcshQuote:If he is fit I would definitely include him in the squad, probably on the bench. Firstly to have a bit more experience and power to call on, but secondly because he seems to have played so little for Bath in his time here and at this point he actually looks to be coming into form, so why let Wales be the only ones to benefit.charlieboa
Think I would rest faletau. He is class but no need to put our internationals through extra games, better off learning more about the other options.
Not adverse to using him off the bench possibly. Just think no relegation allows us to manage players better and look at more options.
Not convinced putting another game into faletaus schedule just cos we don't want Wales taking all the benefit makes huge sense. If he breaks down due to too much workload then we all lose. There is good reason eng don't release players back generally.
From an immediate perspective does having him in the 23 on fri instead of staddon improve our chances of winning, of course it does.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:17:12:57:21 by charlieboa.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Ali1969 (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 15:59
I think there is still a decision to be made as far as Bruce Craig and the team are concerned. Relegation may well have been suspended but there is still the very lucrative European Champions Cup places to be played for and I am sure the bean counters will not be satisfied having to sit at the lesser cup table next season when things MAY return to some kind of normality.
It was a magnificent win last Friday and a huge relief to us all - especially Hooper, but we all know there are still the same issues which need addressing in the squad and training management. One win does not make everything happy and sorted.
What it does do is relieve some of the pressure on Hooper for one but for me the issues this season do not just stem from pressure, there just appears to be complete confusion about what we are about and that comes from the leadership of senior players and coaches/DoR and we have been seriously lacking in that department for me this season - the squad desperately needs direction and handling correctly - if anything has shown up this season is that in some of our performances the players have just looked lost and confused - Bristol was a great example of that.
Hooper will know by this point who is going and who is committing to Bath FC and I personally would love his selection to represent the future this unique situation gives us the perfect opportunity to do this - unfortunately I fear the lure of the ECC places will overrule the need to develop and that might be out of Hoopers control.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:17:16:01:15 by Ali1969.
It was a magnificent win last Friday and a huge relief to us all - especially Hooper, but we all know there are still the same issues which need addressing in the squad and training management. One win does not make everything happy and sorted.
What it does do is relieve some of the pressure on Hooper for one but for me the issues this season do not just stem from pressure, there just appears to be complete confusion about what we are about and that comes from the leadership of senior players and coaches/DoR and we have been seriously lacking in that department for me this season - the squad desperately needs direction and handling correctly - if anything has shown up this season is that in some of our performances the players have just looked lost and confused - Bristol was a great example of that.
Hooper will know by this point who is going and who is committing to Bath FC and I personally would love his selection to represent the future this unique situation gives us the perfect opportunity to do this - unfortunately I fear the lure of the ECC places will overrule the need to develop and that might be out of Hoopers control.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:17:16:01:15 by Ali1969.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 16:01
Quote:Ali1969
there is still the very lucrative European Champions Cup places to be played for and I am sure the bean counters will not be satisfied having to sit at the lesser cup table next season when things MAY return to some kind of normality.
Worcester will be in top 6 if they pick up many more Covid points with the Newcastle game off this weekend as well.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 17/02/2021 18:55
From a challenging for the league perspective I think missing out on champions Cup would be a big boost personally.
We have no realistic chance of going deep in champions Cup currently but if we had sole focus on the league I would feel we ought to be aiming for top 4. Appreciate that sounds overly optimistic but I don't think we are as bad as the last few months suggest.
We have no realistic chance of going deep in champions Cup currently but if we had sole focus on the league I would feel we ought to be aiming for top 4. Appreciate that sounds overly optimistic but I don't think we are as bad as the last few months suggest.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: CoochieCoo (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 09:03
Officials
Referee: Matthew Carley (102nd Premiership game). Assistant Referees: Anthony Woodthorpe & Paul Dix. TMO: David Rose. Citing Officer: David Guyan.
Referee: Matthew Carley (102nd Premiership game). Assistant Referees: Anthony Woodthorpe & Paul Dix. TMO: David Rose. Citing Officer: David Guyan.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 09:24
Wasn't David Guyan a member of our medical team?
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 09:27
Quote:dr.bath1865
Wasn't David Guyan a member of our medical team?
No, he was team manager.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: annie blackthorn (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 10:18
O dear, its Carley again. I had hoped, having watched him over the years and for several seasons 'live' at the Rec that he would have somehow improved - I can't remember which particular incident right in front of us at the Rec caused me to regard him with deep suspicion, but there he still is, winding me up a(from the sofa) on a regular basis.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 10:31
May 2014 Bath and Northampton Saints at The Recreation Ground when he got booed off the field.
[www.theguardian.com]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[www.theguardian.com]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Disunited (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 10:46
That was a cracking side in May 2014.
Abendanon; Watson (Agulla 73), Joseph, Devoto (Henson 72), Banahan; Ford, Young (Stringer 64); James, Webber (Batty 17, Catt 55), Wilson (Perenise 55), Hooper (capt), Attwood (Day 72), Fearns, Mercer, Houston.
Abendanon; Watson (Agulla 73), Joseph, Devoto (Henson 72), Banahan; Ford, Young (Stringer 64); James, Webber (Batty 17, Catt 55), Wilson (Perenise 55), Hooper (capt), Attwood (Day 72), Fearns, Mercer, Houston.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Bath Blues (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 11:15
Stooke if guilty should be shown the exit door asap. No time for drink drivers.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 11:20
Quote:Disunited
That was a cracking side in May 2014.
Abendanon; Watson (Agulla 73), Joseph, Devoto (Henson 72), Banahan; Ford, Young (Stringer 64); James, Webber (Batty 17, Catt 55), Wilson (Perenise 55), Hooper (capt), Attwood (Day 72), Fearns, Mercer, Houston.
Good to know that having a fantastic team on paper that doesn't quite deliver on grass isn't something new!
I was also on the point of commenting, 'Blooky hell - Zach's been with us for 7 seasons ... that's gone quickly'.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 11:46
Quote:Bath Blues
Stooke if guilty should be shown the exit door asap. No time for drink drivers.
Didn't he admit it?
[www.therugbypaper.co.uk]
In a written statement submitted to the disciplinary proceedings, Stooke said: “I understand the potential consequences of my actions and also understand how incredibly lucky I have been to not have hurt/been hurt, died myself or killed anyone. I have had time to reflect and understand that no amount of apologies can make this right.”
According to evidence provided to the disciplinary panel, the crash was caused by Stooke losing control of the vehicle when he reached for some water. It was also revealed the car was damaged to the point it was not capable of being driven further.
Stooke was charged with drink driving and is due to appear at Bath magistrates’ on February 24.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: woodpecker (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 11:52
Quote:BathMatt53
May 2014 Bath and Northampton Saints at The Recreation Ground when he got booed off the field.
[www.theguardian.com]
Carley used to be awful hes improved massively
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:02
Quote:annie blackthorn
O dear, its Carley again. I had hoped, having watched him over the years and for several seasons 'live' at the Rec that he would have somehow improved - I can't remember which particular incident right in front of us at the Rec caused me to regard him with deep suspicion, but there he still is, winding me up a(from the sofa) on a regular basis.
That (Bath v Northampton 2014) was a controversial match and Carley got a lot of stick. But it was not all his fault. He was advised by Ashley Rowden (wrongly as Ash later admitted) that an off the ball incident was innocent, not a late tackle.
A chance at a penalty could have won Bath the game. He was also advised by the third official, Wayne Barnes to go to uncontested scrums and force Bath to lose a forward when both Bath hookers were injured( the second in another- undetected off the ball incident). Both Carl Fearns and Nathan Catt volunteered to hook, Catt persuaded Carley he knew what he was doing and Carley overruled Barnes to allow Bath to keep 15 on the pitch.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: hasta (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:03
Team's Up!
BATH RUGBY SIDE TO FACE GLOUCESTER RUGBY
15. Tom de Glanville, 14. Semesa Rokoduguni, 13. Max Clark, 12. Josh Matavesi, 11. Will Muir, 10. Rhys Priestland, 9. Ben Spencer (c), 1. Juan Schoeman, 2. Tom Dunn, 3. Christian Judge, 4. Josh Bayliss, 5. Mike Williams, 6. Taulupe Faletau, 7. Miles Reid, 8. Zach Mercer
REPLACEMENTS
16. Jack Walker, 17. Jamie Bhatti, 18. Henry Thomas, 19. Tom Ellis, 20. Ethan Staddon, 21. Will Chudley, 22. Tian Schoeman, 23. Jonathan Joseph
BATH RUGBY SIDE TO FACE GLOUCESTER RUGBY
15. Tom de Glanville, 14. Semesa Rokoduguni, 13. Max Clark, 12. Josh Matavesi, 11. Will Muir, 10. Rhys Priestland, 9. Ben Spencer (c), 1. Juan Schoeman, 2. Tom Dunn, 3. Christian Judge, 4. Josh Bayliss, 5. Mike Williams, 6. Taulupe Faletau, 7. Miles Reid, 8. Zach Mercer
REPLACEMENTS
16. Jack Walker, 17. Jamie Bhatti, 18. Henry Thomas, 19. Tom Ellis, 20. Ethan Staddon, 21. Will Chudley, 22. Tian Schoeman, 23. Jonathan Joseph
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:03
McNally out. Bayliss to lock.
BATH RUGBY SIDE TO FACE GLOUCESTER RUGBY
15. Tom de Glanville, 14. Semesa Rokoduguni, 13. Max Clark, 12. Josh Matavesi, 11. Will Muir, 10. Rhys Priestland, 9. Ben Spencer (c), 1. Juan Schoeman, 2. Tom Dunn, 3. Christian Judge, 4. Josh Bayliss, 5. Mike Williams, 6. Taulupe Faletau, 7. Miles Reid, 8. Zach Mercer
REPLACEMENTS
16. Jack Walker, 17. Jamie Bhatti, 18. Henry Thomas, 19. Tom Ellis, 20. Ethan Staddon, 21. Will Chudley, 22. Tian Schoeman, 23. Jonathan Joseph
PG
BATH RUGBY SIDE TO FACE GLOUCESTER RUGBY
15. Tom de Glanville, 14. Semesa Rokoduguni, 13. Max Clark, 12. Josh Matavesi, 11. Will Muir, 10. Rhys Priestland, 9. Ben Spencer (c), 1. Juan Schoeman, 2. Tom Dunn, 3. Christian Judge, 4. Josh Bayliss, 5. Mike Williams, 6. Taulupe Faletau, 7. Miles Reid, 8. Zach Mercer
REPLACEMENTS
16. Jack Walker, 17. Jamie Bhatti, 18. Henry Thomas, 19. Tom Ellis, 20. Ethan Staddon, 21. Will Chudley, 22. Tian Schoeman, 23. Jonathan Joseph
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: WellyBathChief (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:08
Good report PGT but I would argue that at this stage I don't think we are just Playing for Pride. I could be kidding myself and I understand the issues we as a club have but if we win 3 of the next 4 we will be in the same position as we were at that stage last season W6 L7. We have Gloucester, Northampton, Exeter and Newcastle in the next four. So although unlikely it's not beyond the realms of possibility that we win 3 of those. I just hope that top 4 is still a mathematical possibility with a few games to go just to give us something to get excited about in these dire times.
I think due to us starting so late it's easy to think the seasons nearly over but we are still 2 games away from the halfway point.
I think due to us starting so late it's easy to think the seasons nearly over but we are still 2 games away from the halfway point.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:08
Brilliant to see Ellis back in the 23. Also glad they kept the faith with the lads who did so well at Sale.
COYB!
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
COYB!
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: hasta (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:08
Quote:P G TipsQuote:annie blackthorn
O dear, its Carley again. I had hoped, having watched him over the years and for several seasons 'live' at the Rec that he would have somehow improved - I can't remember which particular incident right in front of us at the Rec caused me to regard him with deep suspicion, but there he still is, winding me up a(from the sofa) on a regular basis.
That (Bath v Northampton 2014) was a controversial match and Carley got a lot of stick. But it was not all his fault. He was advised by Ashley Rowden (wrongly as Ash later admitted) that an off the ball incident was innocent, not a late tackle.
A chance at a penalty could have won Bath the game. He was also advised by the third official, Wayne Barnes to go to uncontested scrums and force Bath to lose a forward when both Bath hookers were injured( the second in another- undetected off the ball incident). Both Carl Fearns and Nathan Catt volunteered to hook, Catt persuaded Carley he knew what he was doing and Carley overruled Barnes to allow Bath to keep 15 on the pitch.
PG
Specifically at the end of the game Carley called penalty advantage - a converted penalty would have won us the game. Given the advantage we tried to chip ahead - which didn't work. He then went to the TMO to check for a potential yellow card, but on review decided it wasn't a penalty. Given it wasn't - game over.
This was all fine, except the last decision. Given Carley had called the advantage and impacted the game he should have allowed the game to restart with a scrum to Bath. But he's never had much natural feel for the game - he's very officious and pernickety.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:09
Glos have a super strong team out.
Gloucester Rugby
15. Jason Woodward
14. Louis Rees-Zammit *
13. Chris Harris
12. Tom Seabrook *
11. Ollie Thorley *
10. Billy Twelvetrees
9. Willi Heinz
1. Val Rapava-Ruskin
2. Henry Walker *
3. Fraser Balmain
4. Ed Slater
5. Alex Craig *
6. Jordy Reid
7. Lewis Ludlow (c) *
8. Ruan Ackermann
Replacements
16. Santiago Socino
17. Alex Seville *
18. Jamal Ford-Robinson
19. Ollie Atkins
20. Freddie Clarke *
21. Stephen Varney *
22. George Barton *
23. Henry Trinder *
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Gloucester Rugby
15. Jason Woodward
14. Louis Rees-Zammit *
13. Chris Harris
12. Tom Seabrook *
11. Ollie Thorley *
10. Billy Twelvetrees
9. Willi Heinz
1. Val Rapava-Ruskin
2. Henry Walker *
3. Fraser Balmain
4. Ed Slater
5. Alex Craig *
6. Jordy Reid
7. Lewis Ludlow (c) *
8. Ruan Ackermann
Replacements
16. Santiago Socino
17. Alex Seville *
18. Jamal Ford-Robinson
19. Ollie Atkins
20. Freddie Clarke *
21. Stephen Varney *
22. George Barton *
23. Henry Trinder *
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:11
Thank you hasta for filling in the details. Your version is correct.
Your second para is also the answer given by Tony Spreadbury months later when questioned about the incident.
PG
Your second para is also the answer given by Tony Spreadbury months later when questioned about the incident.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:19
Quote:WellyBathChief
Good report PGT but I would argue that at this stage I don't think we are just Playing for Pride. I could be kidding myself and I understand the issues we as a club have but if we win 3 of the next 4 we will be in the same position as we were at that stage last season W6 L7. We have Gloucester, Northampton, Exeter and Newcastle in the next four. So although unlikely it's not beyond the realms of possibility that we win 3 of those. I just hope that top 4 is still a mathematical possibility with a few games to go just to give us something to get excited about in these dire times.
I think due to us starting so late it's easy to think the seasons nearly over but we are still 2 games away from the halfway point.
But I do refer in para 4 to Top 6, WBC.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: dcsh (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:19
Quote:Bayliss has been excellent in recent weeks and the versatility he is showing make him very valuable. With McNally out it’s an easy decision to start Faletau.P G Tips
McNally out. Bayliss to lock.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:21
I think we are going to miss McNally's bulk and go forward. Ellis may find himself on quite early.
PG
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:52
Big blow to lose McNally again given there are no locks now available.
So we go with 2 x No8, 2 x No 7 and 1 x No 6 in the back 5 of the scrum.....
Bayliss is incredibly versatile - quick enough to hold his own as an emergency winger, willing / able to play in the second row, and clearly an ever improving flanker.
So we go with 2 x No8, 2 x No 7 and 1 x No 6 in the back 5 of the scrum.....
Bayliss is incredibly versatile - quick enough to hold his own as an emergency winger, willing / able to play in the second row, and clearly an ever improving flanker.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: woodpecker (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 12:55
OK I think Glos should win this.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 13:02
Quote:dcshQuote:Bayliss has been excellent in recent weeks and the versatility he is showing make him very valuable. With McNally out it’s an easy decision to start Faletau.P G Tips
McNally out. Bayliss to lock.
Agreed. Once mcnally is out you need to play faletau really.
Stooke timed his idiotic behaviour rather badly given it means we are without all 4 front line locks.
Bayliss must be one of the shortest players to play lock in the modern era. Made a decent fist of it last time though.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 13:11
Quote:charlieboa
Bayliss must be one of the shortest players to play lock in the modern era. Made a decent fist of it last time though.
Yes, I think that some of the shortest who regularly play there are Jean-Luc du Preez, Calum Green and Dave Dennis all of whom are about 6’4”.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 13:15
Strange not to start with Ellis, even if you assume that he will only play, say, 40 minutes, given how underpowered we're going to be in the 2nd row. Maybe Bayliss and Taulupe will swap around a bit?
Really pleased for Max Clark to see him get 2 consecutive starts. Let's hope he can build on last week, and start to offer a real, regular challenge to JJ and Matavesi.
Really pleased for Max Clark to see him get 2 consecutive starts. Let's hope he can build on last week, and start to offer a real, regular challenge to JJ and Matavesi.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 13:24
We'll miss McNally, especially as they have Slater (fortunately no Alemanno). Nice Ellis is on the bench and a shame Faletau has to be pressed into 80 minutes of action but we have few other options.
Clark needs to step up. Like Lawrence if/when he's ever picked for England, he needs to get his hands on the ball more. He does the nuts and bolts ok (makes his tackles etc) but a 13 should offer more in attack. As disappointed as I am with him, I'd quite like JJ to come on for 30 and win us the game.
Should be an open game, and given our lightweight forwards, we might want to throw it around like we did last week. I've no idea what's going to happen, as that Gloucester team on paper shouldn't be bottom and our performances week to week are entirely unpredictable. I just hope it's dry (unlikely) and we put in a performance that builds on what we did last week (no idea).
Clark needs to step up. Like Lawrence if/when he's ever picked for England, he needs to get his hands on the ball more. He does the nuts and bolts ok (makes his tackles etc) but a 13 should offer more in attack. As disappointed as I am with him, I'd quite like JJ to come on for 30 and win us the game.
Should be an open game, and given our lightweight forwards, we might want to throw it around like we did last week. I've no idea what's going to happen, as that Gloucester team on paper shouldn't be bottom and our performances week to week are entirely unpredictable. I just hope it's dry (unlikely) and we put in a performance that builds on what we did last week (no idea).
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: woodpecker (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 13:36
I think Max Clark is fine. He seems to get a lot of criticism on here, he was out for ages.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 13:45
Quote:dr.bath1865
I just hope it's dry (unlikely) and we put in a performance that builds on what we did last week (no idea).
Rainy with gusty wind forecast. Not ideal.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: gaz59 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 13:50
With their back three RP's kicking from hand and Spencer's box kicks have to be on the money or we could have big problems there
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Ali1969 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 15:04
Front row and Mike Williams going to have to put a hell of a shift in again especially as we have lost Josh McNally
mind you thought last week we were light and look what happened, same again this week it is just a question if those 4 guys can take 2 weeks of intensity back to back.
We could really do with Will Spencer and another enforcer fit and fighting, Glos are very strong but they have put that type of side out already this season and lost - only just but they have lost so morale must be quite low.
mind you thought last week we were light and look what happened, same again this week it is just a question if those 4 guys can take 2 weeks of intensity back to back.
We could really do with Will Spencer and another enforcer fit and fighting, Glos are very strong but they have put that type of side out already this season and lost - only just but they have lost so morale must be quite low.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Murty7 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 15:29
How can a Bath v Gloucester game be refereed by someone born in Gloucestershire who undoubtedly grew up supporting Gloucester?
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 15:35
Quote:Murty7
How can a Bath v Gloucester game be refereed by someone born in Gloucestershire who undoubtedly grew up supporting Gloucester?
With no crowds, I think the likelihood of refs/ARs being much influenced is very much reduced - probably as big a factor in the evening out of home/away results as the effect of support on players.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ShortyinBurnham (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 17:31
Just seen on the BBC that they are stating that Wayne Barnes is ref not Carley.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ballsout (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 17:44
We never get any 50:50 call from Barnes, ever. Probably lose, the players have had their backs to the wall performance and the monkey off their back. Back to complacent mediocrity I suspect.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 18:58
I actually agree and think that we never get the rub of the green from Barnes. Not sure what it is and can't put my finger on why his style of refereeing doesn't suit our style of play (if we have one...), but the matches he's reffed in recent memory feel as if they've been some of our worst.
It might be to do with the fact I think he's a ref who rarely allows defensive teams a chance of jackalling. It needs to be absolutely nailed on (i.e. tackler rolled away and nowhere in sight, jackaller clearly on his feet and lifting the ball). So he refs the breakdown to the letter of the law but in recent times when we've been battered by teams with low possession, we've had no chance of a turnover, our defence has been porous and it's almost inevitably led to a try for them as a result.
Might just be a perception thing, as we've been rubbish recently, but strikes me that he's a ref who we never get on the right side of. As said, could just be because we haven't been very good of late and he's a ref who, for the most part, rewards the attacking team.
It might be to do with the fact I think he's a ref who rarely allows defensive teams a chance of jackalling. It needs to be absolutely nailed on (i.e. tackler rolled away and nowhere in sight, jackaller clearly on his feet and lifting the ball). So he refs the breakdown to the letter of the law but in recent times when we've been battered by teams with low possession, we've had no chance of a turnover, our defence has been porous and it's almost inevitably led to a try for them as a result.
Might just be a perception thing, as we've been rubbish recently, but strikes me that he's a ref who we never get on the right side of. As said, could just be because we haven't been very good of late and he's a ref who, for the most part, rewards the attacking team.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 19:00
Either way, he's certainly a ref who was born in Gloucestershire! Ha.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: CoochieCoo (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 20:56
Revised official from Premiership website
Friday 19 February
Bath Rugby v Gloucester Rugby (The Rec) - Live on BT Sport 2, programme starts at 7pm, kick-off at 7.45pm
Referee: Wayne Barnes
Assistant Referees: Matthew Carley and Paul Dix
TMO: Tom Foley
Citing Officer: David Guyan
Friday 19 February
Bath Rugby v Gloucester Rugby (The Rec) - Live on BT Sport 2, programme starts at 7pm, kick-off at 7.45pm
Referee: Wayne Barnes
Assistant Referees: Matthew Carley and Paul Dix
TMO: Tom Foley
Citing Officer: David Guyan
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: joethefanatic (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 21:08
Quote:CoochieCoo
Revised official from Premiership website
Friday 19 February
Bath Rugby v Gloucester Rugby (The Rec) - Live on BT Sport 2, programme starts at 7pm, kick-off at 7.45pm
Referee: Wayne Barnes
Assistant Referees: Matthew Carley and Paul Dix
TMO: Tom Foley
Citing Officer: David Guyan
The Jury of the Damned, then
☺
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 21:27
If we win this with a makeshift pack it will be about spirit and application, those backs look a real handful!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Bath Hammer (IP Logged)
Date: 18/02/2021 23:40
That is a really strong Gloucester side & they are well overdue a win. They will be expecting their luck to turn & we may well be the reluctant recipients.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Rokobilly (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 06:58
Quote:dr.bath1865
I actually agree and think that we never get the rub of the green from Barnes. Not sure what it is and can't put my finger on why his style of refereeing doesn't suit our style of play (if we have one...), but the matches he's reffed in recent memory feel as if they've been some of our worst.
It might be to do with the fact I think he's a ref who rarely allows defensive teams a chance of jackalling. It needs to be absolutely nailed on (i.e. tackler rolled away and nowhere in sight, jackaller clearly on his feet and lifting the ball). So he refs the breakdown to the letter of the law but in recent times when we've been battered by teams with low possession, we've had no chance of a turnover, our defence has been porous and it's almost inevitably led to a try for them as a result.
Might just be a perception thing, as we've been rubbish recently, but strikes me that he's a ref who we never get on the right side of. As said, could just be because we haven't been very good of late and he's a ref who, for the most part, rewards the attacking team.
This is my impression too. I winced when I saw the appointment. In my head, I can hear Barnes saying "too long" or "didn't lift the ball" in my head before blowing up and sending us down to the corner to collapse a maul and further punishment.
Anyone know if there are stats available that show our record with different officials in charge? I suspect we actually do just as well in terms of win % with Mr Barnes in charge as any other ref...
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Bath Hammer (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 07:14
I think the consensus view is expect a loss but hope for a win. I’ll watch it on replay if we win.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Rokobilly (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 07:22
Some very rough research suggests our last 5 Prem games with Mr Barnes in charge:
- Bristol (A) three weeks ago
- Leicester (A) 3rd January. Lose after we blew a 14 point lead
- Saracens (A) last game of last season when we couldn't get out of their half in the last 30 and drew after late try after 5m line out
- Wasps (H) last year. Uncontested scrums. Lose from a late rolling maul try.
- Leicester (H) last year. We won a poor match if memory serves me correctly.
5 games in 1.5 seasons: 1W 1D 3L
I'm not blaming Wayne for any of the results at all but in a few of those games we were definitely getting pinged regularly and giving up ball and territory. I hope we have learned lessons before tonight's game.
- Bristol (A) three weeks ago
- Leicester (A) 3rd January. Lose after we blew a 14 point lead
- Saracens (A) last game of last season when we couldn't get out of their half in the last 30 and drew after late try after 5m line out
- Wasps (H) last year. Uncontested scrums. Lose from a late rolling maul try.
- Leicester (H) last year. We won a poor match if memory serves me correctly.
5 games in 1.5 seasons: 1W 1D 3L
I'm not blaming Wayne for any of the results at all but in a few of those games we were definitely getting pinged regularly and giving up ball and territory. I hope we have learned lessons before tonight's game.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 09:16
Interesting Roko. Thanks for doing that and your finding sort of backs up my addled thinking.
As you say, not blaming Barnes, and I do think he's a great ref who always puts on a good looking game of rugby for the neutral. But maybe it's different when you support one of the teams? Especially the one not doing well, as he's clearly a ref that likes the attacking team to keep the ball, and we didn't have much ball in the Bristol and Leicester games. Not his fault – it's ours! – as our defence cracked all too easily when sustained pressure was exerted upon it and either conceded penalties or tries (or penalty tries!).
If we can produce a defensive effort like last week then we should be in with a better chance, as we did very well without the ball, keeping our discipline and eventually forcing mistakes or turnovers.
As you say, not blaming Barnes, and I do think he's a great ref who always puts on a good looking game of rugby for the neutral. But maybe it's different when you support one of the teams? Especially the one not doing well, as he's clearly a ref that likes the attacking team to keep the ball, and we didn't have much ball in the Bristol and Leicester games. Not his fault – it's ours! – as our defence cracked all too easily when sustained pressure was exerted upon it and either conceded penalties or tries (or penalty tries!).
If we can produce a defensive effort like last week then we should be in with a better chance, as we did very well without the ball, keeping our discipline and eventually forcing mistakes or turnovers.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: TG Kesmo (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 12:10
I thought it was just me who thought that Wayne Barnes’ referring had gone done a notch when he announced he was giving up the international gigs. Maybe it’s like the old adage when you announce you are retiring from the game you play like you already have. It’s not just Bath I have watched other games (I blame lockdown) where he has been below his previously excellent standards.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 12:42
I'm sure Barnes gets the majority of his decisions right. The thing that drives me nuts is his extreme version of 'referee as coach', constantly telling the players how well they've done, and telling them how and when not to break the laws, is like watching an Under 12s game.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 12:52
I think that Mr Barnes is pretty good, the only thing that annoys me a bit is his 'matey' approach, calling players by their nicknames etc. Having said that, I can't wait for him to refer to Muir as 'horse' this evening.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: woodpecker (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 12:52
I think he used to be better he sort of believed the hype about himself, its like he doesnt have any self awareness/doubt, you can always get better, reassess..
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: B4thB4ck (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 13:15
Appearing as a pundit has undermined his authority I think, I want to hear from refs more but once they have retired would be better. I agree with the matey approach going too far, his communication is good otherwise and I think he has an empathy for the players.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Awp (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 14:13
With Dickson and his Quins connections, Ridley with Leicester, I often think it strange when they get given their ex team to referee, the same when Phil Watters runs the line either for Gloucester or against Bath, surely if it’s a 50/50 decision it’s only natural you favour yours, however with the pool of referees and ARs being so small I don’t think it is possible to not keep them away from their ex teams throughout course of a season. They probably go the extra to show that they are not favouring them, and I can’t think of any really controversial moments where you could say that they have. I know when I tried for a short while to officiate I couldn’t help but favour my team on the 50/50s!!
With regards to Barnes I have come full circle with him. I used to dread him refereeing our games, however realised it was me and he is actually a very good referee, and now more than happy when we get him as I know it will be fair and that he isn’t afraid to make difficult decisions (just have to make sure it’s not against us!)
With regards to Barnes I have come full circle with him. I used to dread him refereeing our games, however realised it was me and he is actually a very good referee, and now more than happy when we get him as I know it will be fair and that he isn’t afraid to make difficult decisions (just have to make sure it’s not against us!)
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 15:53
[www.metoffice.gov.uk] - Dan Punderfoot & Windy tonight!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 16:12
Quote:Mike the Taxi
https://www.metoffice.gov.uk/weather/forecast/gcnk62de6#?date=2021-02-19 - Dan Punderfoot & Windy tonight!
Glad I didn't put a bet on it, the teams were close before that forecast and is going to be a lottery now. Rhys does well in poor weather but Glos have the bigger / stronger pack? Rhys may also not want to be kicking to touch with the makeshift lineout. COYB!!
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 16:28
With the wind coming from the South we need to be playing from the sports centre end in the first half, pin them down with tactical kicking from Spencer and Priestland and try to get some points on the board. Hopefully then the rain will ease off and we can get Schoeman on to play a possession game in the second half and keep them out.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: B4thB4ck (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 16:34
Remember, big guys take longer to turn and the soft ground will tire them quicker. They had lineout problems recently so could be something we can exploit. Maybe we can spread the play and run them around a bit.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 16:35
Quote:B4thB4ck
Remember, big guys take longer to turn and the soft ground will tire them quicker. They had lineout problems recently so could be something we can exploit. Maybe we can spread the play and run them around a bit.
Will be tough to cause them lineout problems when we have no locks!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: B4thB4ck (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 17:04
Quote:malcoQuote:B4thB4ck
Remember, big guys take longer to turn and the soft ground will tire them quicker. They had lineout problems recently so could be something we can exploit. Maybe we can spread the play and run them around a bit.
Will be tough to cause them lineout problems when we have no locks!
Sssshhhhh.....trying to be positive here!
Anyway, the problems were at 2 so if they dont throw straight who needs the big guys?
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 19:45
A very strong Gloucester side , not feeling good about this one .
Bath by 2 or Glos., by 12 !
Neal Hatley fronting up about being defence coach as well as head coach and accepting the results are down to him . Asked if Bath are looking for a defence coach and no was the answer . Defence stats are horrendous 12 th place in all of them !
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Bath by 2 or Glos., by 12 !
Neal Hatley fronting up about being defence coach as well as head coach and accepting the results are down to him . Asked if Bath are looking for a defence coach and no was the answer . Defence stats are horrendous 12 th place in all of them !
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 19:58
Wayne Barnes awards red card to Glos Ruskin fowl play against Baylis!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 19:59
Red card. Correct decision
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: jras6 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:00
Dilly trying to justify it says it all
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:00
Quote:Mike the Taxi
Wayne Barnes awards red card to Glos Ruskin fowl play against Baylis!
Was there some birds on the pitch Mike ?
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:03
Sid told me!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Awp (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:07
Quote:Mike the Taxi
Wayne Barnes awards red card to Glos Ruskin fowl play against Baylis!
Harsh red, benefits us but was as a result of a poor tackle from Bayliss.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: CoochieCoo (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:08
Dayglo arguing that Ruskin was protecting himself because Bayliss should have gone low! Strange comment!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:09
Baylis now back on
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Bath Blues (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:15
Shame the cherry and whites are not wearing 'cheery and white' good to see the score graphic on bt sport is!!!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:16
Glos win turnover scrum and get penalty.
Bath giving away penalties since red card!
Bath giving away penalties since red card!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ken_jnr (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:16
We might be better if had a second row or two. Not looking amazing so far.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:16
Considering Bath are a man up it’s not going well . Scrum poor . 0 - 6 
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:22
Roko hurts wrist in tackle; broken?
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:23
Has Spencer passed to Priestland yet?
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:23
Yet another penalty , Roko off injured, JJ on !
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:24
JJ on for Roko
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:29
Bath lose another scrum (turnover) and penalised
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:29
Scrum on the glos line and stuff it up !
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ken_jnr (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:29
I’m downgrading my assessment to “we look rubbish”. We are hugely underpowered without our locks.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: @Hydor18 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:30
Two backrows at lock is taking its toll on our scrum.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:32
Quote:ken_jnr
I’m downgrading my assessment to “we look rubbish”. We are hugely underpowered without our locks.
I’ve changed too ‘ we are rubbish ‘. No direction , no more than 3 phases, whose the leader ?
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: dannyf2 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:34
This is woeful
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: stephen4944 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:35
Playing for pride?
Ha
If only
That half was embarrassing!
Ha
If only
That half was embarrassing!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:35
TF try!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ken_jnr (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:35
That was an incredible try from nowhere!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:36
Good try , not before time !
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:36
RP converts
HT
7 v 6
HT
7 v 6
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Never In Doubt (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:37
Pure class from Joseph but got to be more expansive in the second half to win this.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:38
Muir looks so dangerous when he gets the ball, fast and aggressive, then Bayliss, JJ, TdG and Faletau. Moves like that are worth enduring 38 minutes of crud!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: 9215 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:40
I don’t know what I was expecting from the match, but it definitely wasn’t this
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:40
Great try but we need to be more streetwise. Glos offside at all phases but it takes 39 minutes for officials to notice, so we need to keep them honest and make sure they are exposed.
We also need to protect our ball at set piece and ruck possession MUCH better.
PG
We also need to protect our ball at set piece and ruck possession MUCH better.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: CoochieCoo (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:41
That last ruck and a Glos leg kicking the ball out of Spencer’s hands is a yellow surely?
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:43
The wind must be incredibly strong to be making us look this terrible...
Seriously that was terrible. Fair play to Gloucester who have been excellent but we offered nothing for 39m. Still, grind them down, kick the corners, take the 4 points (at least!), enjoy your weekend.
Seriously that was terrible. Fair play to Gloucester who have been excellent but we offered nothing for 39m. Still, grind them down, kick the corners, take the 4 points (at least!), enjoy your weekend.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: 9215 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:43
Quote:CoochieCoo
That last ruck and a Glos leg kicking the ball out of Spencer’s hands is a yellow surely?
I think it’s not because we scored so advantage over
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:46
Quote:P G Tips
Great try but we need to be more streetwise. Glos offside at all phases but it takes 39 minutes for officials to notice, so we need to keep them honest and make sure they are exposed.
We also need to protect our ball at set piece and ruck possession MUCH better.
PG
Some of those offsides at the line out are about 5 yards off.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:47
Quote:CoochieCoo
That last ruck and a Glos leg kicking the ball out of Spencer’s hands is a yellow surely?
Exactly, or at least a penalty and I had the feeling if it had been the other way round Wayne would have blown straight away!
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:48
Wind will be a factor in the second half.
Gloucester were able to just keep it tight, play a slow game and kick for the territory and touch. Our lack of second rows played right into their hands, but they shouldn't find territory so easy this half.
Somehow we need to keep scrums to a minumum.
Gloucester were able to just keep it tight, play a slow game and kick for the territory and touch. Our lack of second rows played right into their hands, but they shouldn't find territory so easy this half.
Somehow we need to keep scrums to a minumum.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: CoochieCoo (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:50
Quote:9215Quote:CoochieCoo
That last ruck and a Glos leg kicking the ball out of Spencer’s hands is a yellow surely?
I think it’s not because we scored so advantage over
Foul play whether we scored or not should always get a card!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:50
There was one wide shot that showed the Gloucs back level with the back foot of the ruck, but it was the Bath back foot!
Another offence that should be easy for the TJs to police much better.
Another offence that should be easy for the TJs to police much better.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:52
Quote:Awp24975Quote:Mike the Taxi
Wayne Barnes awards red card to Glos Ruskin fowl play against Baylis!
Harsh red, benefits us but was as a result of a poor tackle from Bayliss.
'Fraid not.
Law 9 Foul Play
11. A player must not physically or verbally abuse anyone. Physical abuse includes, but is not limited to, biting, punching, contact with the eye or eye area, striking with any part of the arm (including stiff-arm tackles), shoulder, head or knee(s), stamping, trampling, tripping or kicking.
Definitions:
Hand-off: A permitted action, taken by a ball-carrier to fend off an opponent, using the palm of the hand.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: 9215 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:55
Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:CoochieCoo
That last ruck and a Glos leg kicking the ball out of Spencer’s hands is a yellow surely?
I think it’s not because we scored so advantage over
Foul play whether we scored or not should always get a card!
I agree that it should, but I believe the rules say otherwise. I remember one of our later last season games (Wasps I think) where both sides were penalised for very similar bringing down mauls near the try line. We managed to score so it was advantage over, they didn’t so we got a yellow, seemed very unfair to me.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 20:57
TdG off Schoeman on
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:00
Bath win scrum penalty!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:00
“I don’t believe it “. Bath win scrum penalty!
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:01
Bath attacking Glos line
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:04
Bath try disallowed, RP for penalty
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:05
Converted
10 v 6
10 v 6
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:08
Red for Williams ?
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:08
Williams red!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:09
Not quite as clear as the Gloucs one, but players must go lower.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:10
Ellis on for Max Clark
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Beergoggles (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:10
Pretty stupid to go into a tackle blind like that. No intent but these players need to learn.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:11
Clear offence.
PG
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:12
Bath 5 metre lineout at Glos line
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:15
Bath free kick in Glos 5 metre - re-scrum
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:16
Bath attacking Glos line
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:17
Bath penalty advantage
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:18
Glos turnover
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:19
Dunn off Walker on
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ken_jnr (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:20
I’m going to need a better reason to buy a ticket to watch Bath play again after lockdown than this dross.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:21
Shockingly bad game of rugby this
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:21
Heinz high tackle on Muir
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Beergoggles (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:22
For a Tap and Go penalty doesn’t the tap have to go before the go ? Glaws were almost within touching distance before we tapped.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:22
RP penalty conv
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:22
Quote:ken_jnr
I’m going to need a better reason to buy a ticket to watch Bath play again after lockdown than this dross.
Agree, I was considering it after the Sale game , now not sadly .
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:23
Glos give away penalty on restart
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:23
Muir at first receiver again. High tackle and penalty. 3 points
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:24
JJ making a few breaks this game
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:32
Glos penalty
13 v 9
13 v 9
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:36
Glos try
13 v 14
13 v 14
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:37
JJ yellow!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:38
Poor again from Bath . 13 - 14. Yellow for JJ .
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh
"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:38
Conversion missed
13 v 14
13 v 14
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Bath Blues (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:38
Hooper out tonight please.
Enough is enough.
Enough is enough.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:38
4 minutes to rescue this
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: CoochieCoo (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:39
Quote:9215Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:CoochieCoo
That last ruck and a Glos leg kicking the ball out of Spencer’s hands is a yellow surely?
I think it’s not because we scored so advantage over
Foul play whether we scored or not should always get a card!
I agree that it should, but I believe the rules say otherwise. I remember one of our later last season games (Wasps I think) where both sides were penalised for very similar bringing down mauls near the try line. We managed to score so it was advantage over, they didn’t so we got a yellow, seemed very unfair to me.
So JJ gets a yellow after they score a try. That appears to be the evenness of Wayne Barnes!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Armchair Fan (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:39
What a frustrating. Hard to watch.
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I like turtles.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:19:21:40:59 by Armchair Fan.
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I like turtles.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:19:21:40:59 by Armchair Fan.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:39
How can it be a yellow for Joseph and not for Heinz (I think) in the lead up to our try?
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Armchair Fan (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:39
What a saddening performance.
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I like turtles.
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I like turtles.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:40
Wayne's inconsistencies that run against Bath.
45m kick for Rhys
45m kick for Rhys
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:40
RP penalty!
16 v 14
16 v 14
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ken_jnr (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:41
I know that taking Obano, Stuart, McNally, Ewells, Stooke and Underhill out of the pack makes a difference. But apart from a couple of flashes we have been able to exploit absolutely none of the space at all.
A pair of locks would have made a huge difference but we have been poor.
A pair of locks would have made a huge difference but we have been poor.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:41
Stuff it up yer jumper time!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:42
FT
16 v 14
Phew!!
16 v 14
Phew!!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:42
Quote:Old Bath Tub
A very strong Gloucester side , not feeling good about this one .
Bath by 2 or Glos., by 12 !
Neal Hatley fronting up about being defence coach as well as head coach and accepting the results are down to him . Asked if Bath are looking for a defence coach and no was the answer . Defence stats are horrendous 12 th place in all of them !
Bath by 2. Got that !
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Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Armchair Fan (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:43
Amazing.
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I like turtles.
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I like turtles.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:43
Yes we've been poor, but you cannot underestimate the impact of no second rows on a wet & windy night on a very heavy pitch.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Bath Blues (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:43
That is where we are, just beating the worst team in the Premiership.
Not good
Not good
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Never In Doubt (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:44
Lucky and really poor decision making when we were a man up but hope that adds a bit of confidence. Without a proper lock we are always going to struggle.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:45
Jack Walker takes the restart and Bath, thankfully, retain possession
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Beergoggles (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:45
Very impressed with closing out the last 90 seconds and Rhys kicking in this weather. Other than that .... I’ve got nothing.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Awp (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:46
Quote:P G TipsQuote:Awp24975Quote:Mike the Taxi
Wayne Barnes awards red card to Glos Ruskin fowl play against Baylis!
Harsh red, benefits us but was as a result of a poor tackle from Bayliss.
'Fraid not.
Law 9 Foul Play
11. A player must not physically or verbally abuse anyone. Physical abuse includes, but is not limited to, biting, punching, contact with the eye or eye area, striking with any part of the arm (including stiff-arm tackles), shoulder, head or knee(s), stamping, trampling, tripping or kicking.
Definitions:
Hand-off: A permitted action, taken by a ball-carrier to fend off an opponent, using the palm of the hand.
PG
I know what the laws say, I just don’t think it was deserving of a red card that’s all.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Rokobilly (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:46
That was horrid to watch. Two poor teams.... But off my feet with Rhys's penalty. A win doesn't paper over the substantial cracks but it's better than a defeat.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ken_jnr (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:46
Well we did it so we can take that as a positive. That was still a really poor pair of teams and a bad advert for the Premiership.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: dcsh (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:46
Well from the point Gloucester got a red card it became a must win for Bath and thank goodness they did it!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ken_jnr (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:46
Well we did it so we can take that as a positive. That was still a really poor pair of teams and a bad advert for the Premiership.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: 9215 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:50
Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:CoochieCoo
That last ruck and a Glos leg kicking the ball out of Spencer’s hands is a yellow surely?
I think it’s not because we scored so advantage over
Foul play whether we scored or not should always get a card!
I agree that it should, but I believe the rules say otherwise. I remember one of our later last season games (Wasps I think) where both sides were penalised for very similar bringing down mauls near the try line. We managed to score so it was advantage over, they didn’t so we got a yellow, seemed very unfair to me.
So JJ gets a yellow after they score a try. That appears to be the evenness of Wayne Barnes!
Yes that doesn’t fit with what I thought!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Coalminer (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:51
Two teams playing badly, difficult weather. inconsistent refereeing and that all adds up to terrible game.
We are desperately missing proper second rows bug at least we managed to squeak a win and 4 points.
We are desperately missing proper second rows bug at least we managed to squeak a win and 4 points.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: dcsh (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:54
Quote:Does a deliberate knock on count as foul play? I’ve heard some penalties referred to at technical and that you don’t go back for then if advantage is played. I’d have thought a knock on was technical rather than foul play, but maybe there isn’t really that separation!9215Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:CoochieCoo
That last ruck and a Glos leg kicking the ball out of Spencer’s hands is a yellow surely?
I think it’s not because we scored so advantage over
Foul play whether we scored or not should always get a card!
I agree that it should, but I believe the rules say otherwise. I remember one of our later last season games (Wasps I think) where both sides were penalised for very similar bringing down mauls near the try line. We managed to score so it was advantage over, they didn’t so we got a yellow, seemed very unfair to me.
So JJ gets a yellow after they score a try. That appears to be the evenness of Wayne Barnes!
Yes that doesn’t fit with what I thought!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: B4thB4ck (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:55
I look at the team on the pitch and think it was all about the result.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: CoochieCoo (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:55
Quote:9215Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:CoochieCoo
That last ruck and a Glos leg kicking the ball out of Spencer’s hands is a yellow surely?
I think it’s not because we scored so advantage over
Foul play whether we scored or not should always get a card!
I agree that it should, but I believe the rules say otherwise. I remember one of our later last season games (Wasps I think) where both sides were penalised for very similar bringing down mauls near the try line. We managed to score so it was advantage over, they didn’t so we got a yellow, seemed very unfair to me.
So JJ gets a yellow after they score a try. That appears to be the evenness of Wayne Barnes!
Yes that doesn’t fit with what I thought!
Barnes inconsistency. Very pleased with that win, who said no relegation takes away passion. Loving the fact that the pro Gloucs commentators shut up on the end!
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:19:21:57:30 by CoochieCoo.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ChippenhamRoman (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:56
Quote:Rokobilly
That was horrid to watch. Two poor teams.... But off my feet with Rhys's penalty. A win doesn't paper over the substantial cracks but it's better than a defeat.
I was exactly the same.
Such a poor game.
Knock ons, penalties given away aplenty, red cards, players isolated.
Thankfully Glos were marginally more @#$%&.
Still take a win v Glos every day of the week.
J
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: 9215 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:57
It was certainly an engaging game
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ken_jnr (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:58
Hooper looking a bit TOO pleased with the win during the interview. We just beat the 12th placed team at home by two points after playing against 14 men for 71 minutes.
I know he has been under pressure but a cup final this was not.
I know he has been under pressure but a cup final this was not.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 21:59
Lost another one in Williams tonight, Ellis and Bayliss as locks is a bit desperate however good they are. Spencer was getting overrun on our put it as we were not able to squeeze the ball forward. He had zero protection.
Also Spencer off with an HIA. Faletau with Wales. We are scrabbling for players next week!
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Also Spencer off with an HIA. Faletau with Wales. We are scrabbling for players next week!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: TomReagan (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:01
A win in a local derby played in poor conditions against a side most posters thought we'd lose to has to be worth some praise. Not much quality but a good try, better defence and we snuck it at the end, which makes a change against Glos. A man advantage for 40 mins but no 2nd rows so not all doom and gloom as far as I'm concerned. Consecutive wins must help our fragile confidence too.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:02
If Stooke isn't in jail, he'll be available next week.
Hope the other injuries aren't serious though Roko's didn't look good.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:19:22:03:37 by Dorset Boy.
Hope the other injuries aren't serious though Roko's didn't look good.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:19:22:03:37 by Dorset Boy.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: JFPC (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:04
Quote:ken_jnr
Hooper looking a bit TOO pleased with the win during the interview. We just beat the 12th placed team at home by two points after playing against 14 men for 71 minutes.
I know he has been under pressure but a cup final this was not.
To be fair it was we were only a man up for about 40 mins.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:05
Quote:Awp24975
[
I know what the laws say, I just don’t think it was deserving of a red card that’s all.
The game faces an existential crisis with parts of the medical lobby demanding it be banned in schools and radically changed for adults to avoid head injury.
For once an official decides to apply the laws to protect a player - what would you have him do instead?
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:07
That is a good result with the strength of the respective sides. Gloucester near full strength, Bath missing most of the first choice pack.
The additional injuries and suspension of Williams are really going to hurt us next week. Desperately need McNally and Will Spencer to be fit. Didn't look good for Roko and hopefully Ben Spencer isn't injured.
The game was ruined as a spectacle by the red cards. Neither player was trying to break the laws, let alone hurt an opponent. Sent off for being human. Our sport is being turned into a farce. It totally changed the course of the match and spoilt it for me. Yellow cards would have been more than adequate.
The additional injuries and suspension of Williams are really going to hurt us next week. Desperately need McNally and Will Spencer to be fit. Didn't look good for Roko and hopefully Ben Spencer isn't injured.
The game was ruined as a spectacle by the red cards. Neither player was trying to break the laws, let alone hurt an opponent. Sent off for being human. Our sport is being turned into a farce. It totally changed the course of the match and spoilt it for me. Yellow cards would have been more than adequate.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Bath Hammer (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:08
I really don’t see any positives to take out of that game. Priestland kept his nerve & his kicking has won us a few games for all the stick he takes. To just beat a struggling team with a man advantage for the majority of the game is as bad as it gets & all we can come up with as an excuse is that we didn’t have any regular locks playing. It just goes to show how inept our attacking play is. I just hope Dempsey’s replacement can make a significant difference.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Awp (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:08
Quote:P G TipsQuote:Awp24975
[
I know what the laws say, I just don’t think it was deserving of a red card that’s all.
The game faces an existential crisis with parts of the medical lobby demanding it be banned in schools and radically changed for adults to avoid head injury.
For once an official decides to apply the laws to protect a player - what would you have him do instead?
PG
Yellow
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:08
Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:CoochieCooQuote:9215Quote:CoochieCoo
That last ruck and a Glos leg kicking the ball out of Spencer’s hands is a yellow surely?
I think it’s not because we scored so advantage over
Foul play whether we scored or not should always get a card!
I agree that it should, but I believe the rules say otherwise. I remember one of our later last season games (Wasps I think) where both sides were penalised for very similar bringing down mauls near the try line. We managed to score so it was advantage over, they didn’t so we got a yellow, seemed very unfair to me.
So JJ gets a yellow after they score a try. That appears to be the evenness of Wayne Barnes!
Yes that doesn’t fit with what I thought!
Barnes inconsistency. Very pleased with that win, who said no relegation takes away passion. Loving the fact that the pro Gloucs commentators shut up on the end!
I'd love to hear how Wayne Barnes explains that away. One player kicks the ball out of Spencers hands, the other a deliberate knock on, in both instances a try results playing the advantage yet one carded and one not!
Fed up with hearing about spiral kicks, Moyne eulogising over a Faletau mess up, Dallaglio vacillating withe the scoreboard. Have to say I'll not be watching that back!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:12
Yes, of course it was horrid to watch but a team playing 5th & 6th choice locks against a larger, more physical pack desperate for only their second win of the season are always going to struggle.
Disrupted in that area again by Bayliss' HIA and Williams's red card, most of the forward effort was rearguard action. Yet Bath managed a win.
The try was gorgeous. Defence overall much better than 2/3 weeks ago. Shame it fell off for their late try -by which time the entire team would have been very tired.
The major criticism has to be about decision making - overuse of the pick and drive, poor restart contest, poor ball retention. On the few occasions we had the ball in space 50% were woeful choices, 50% incisive attacks.
PG
Disrupted in that area again by Bayliss' HIA and Williams's red card, most of the forward effort was rearguard action. Yet Bath managed a win.
The try was gorgeous. Defence overall much better than 2/3 weeks ago. Shame it fell off for their late try -by which time the entire team would have been very tired.
The major criticism has to be about decision making - overuse of the pick and drive, poor restart contest, poor ball retention. On the few occasions we had the ball in space 50% were woeful choices, 50% incisive attacks.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:16
Quote:P G TipsQuote:Awp24975
[
I know what the laws say, I just don’t think it was deserving of a red card that’s all.
The game faces an existential crisis with parts of the medical lobby demanding it be banned in schools and radically changed for adults to avoid head injury.
For once an official decides to apply the laws to protect a player - what would you have him do instead?
PG
The problem for me is simply this.
It is human to err. Even the very best trained, most highly talented humans make human errors. There is a world of difference between deliberate foul play and making a human error.
If we are sending players off for making human errors then that is farcical because they are not choosing to make the error and therefore cannot correct that error.
The only way to stop human error is to ban the sport.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: WellyBathChief (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:17
Quote:Bath Blues
That is where we are, just beating the worst team in the Premiership.
Not good
Also where top of the table Bristol were only last week.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:18
Quote:Awp24975Quote:P G TipsQuote:Awp24975
[
I know what the laws say, I just don’t think it was deserving of a red card that’s all.
The game faces an existential crisis with parts of the medical lobby demanding it be banned in schools and radically changed for adults to avoid head injury.
For once an official decides to apply the laws to protect a player - what would you have him do instead?
PG
Yellow
I would sort of agree except that PG's logic has to win out every time. Do we see players taken out in the air following that blitz, not any more. Its painful to watch and not what we grew up with but its right. Upright tackles are too risky they have to go along with dangerous clear outs. The game has to change.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: dannyf2 (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:19
Hope roko's shoulder is ok
That was rubbish wasn't it. I'm glad we won, but wowee we are bad.
That was rubbish wasn't it. I'm glad we won, but wowee we are bad.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: B4thB4ck (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:20
I didn't see the game but will watch the re run. Which will be the happier team? The one with a strong line up who lost the game or the weak team who know they can get better but still won?
Shedweb is always interesting, they think their team played well so if that is true I wont be worrying about the lack of style. We never had a clear enough lead to start opening up.
Shedweb is always interesting, they think their team played well so if that is true I wont be worrying about the lack of style. We never had a clear enough lead to start opening up.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:25
...And even JJ made a few breaks, tonight!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:27
The use of an elbow or forearm as a handoff has always been against the law. It is just that officials have got lazy about applying it.
If you have been concussed by an elbow to the face in such circumstances, or seen your best mate stretchered off with foam coming out of the corner of his mouth after receiving that kind of blow and had to wait half the night with him in casualty until he got the all clear, you might take a different view.
PG
If you have been concussed by an elbow to the face in such circumstances, or seen your best mate stretchered off with foam coming out of the corner of his mouth after receiving that kind of blow and had to wait half the night with him in casualty until he got the all clear, you might take a different view.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Rawce (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:31
So, how many weeks out for Williams after that pointlessly dangerous challenge? Fortunately we are flush with locks right now...
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:33
Quote:P G Tips
The use of an elbow or forearm as a handoff has always been against the law. It is just that officials have got lazy about applying it.
If you have been concussed by an elbow to the face in such circumstances, or seen your best mate stretchered off with foam coming out of the corner of his mouth after receiving that kind of blow and had to wait half the night with him in casualty until he got the all clear, you might take a different view.
PG
It isn't lazy though, it's just mistimed. It has happened in a fraction of a second and being human the player has made a misjudgement. I absolutely do not believe he made a conscious decision to hit Bayliss in the face with his forearm.
The Williams red was much the same. He's lined the player up and just before the expected collision Schoeman has hit him and changed the point of impact. You can see Williams lifting his left arm to wrap but the impact of Schoeman's tackle has then driven the carrier into Williams's right shoulder.
Complete accident, totally involuntary. He has nothing to learn from this and he could not have avoided it. It's just what happens when human beings play a high speed collision game.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:39
Dreadful game of rugby and a pretty dire performance.
Being generous we were missing loads of players inc all 4 senior locks. We then suffered lots of injuries in the game. Then got a red card, then a yellow card...went behind...and yet still managed to win.
Important that mcnally is back next week. Guess we will have little option but to play stooke as could do with bayliss in backrow with faletau away.
Winning will help with confidence and at least shows some element of resilience.
Was a classic bath showing sadly though of lurching from one brainless bit of rugby to the next. So much we do amazes me (and not in a good way).
Being generous we were missing loads of players inc all 4 senior locks. We then suffered lots of injuries in the game. Then got a red card, then a yellow card...went behind...and yet still managed to win.
Important that mcnally is back next week. Guess we will have little option but to play stooke as could do with bayliss in backrow with faletau away.
Winning will help with confidence and at least shows some element of resilience.
Was a classic bath showing sadly though of lurching from one brainless bit of rugby to the next. So much we do amazes me (and not in a good way).
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:41
Malco - it is the officials laziness I was referring to, not the player's.
PG
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:42
Nice to see faletau get through 80 mins for us. The guy is class.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:45
Oh and if I see clark one more time doing his hair whilst we are defending our own line I think I may have to pack up watching....
Tbf maybe the play had stopped by then.
At least we didn't concede a try unlike last time (was it saints away from a 5 yd tap and go as he got his top knot back in position?)
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:19:22:47:44 by charlieboa.
Tbf maybe the play had stopped by then.
At least we didn't concede a try unlike last time (was it saints away from a 5 yd tap and go as he got his top knot back in position?)
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:19:22:47:44 by charlieboa.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Coalminer (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:45
He is good. Unlike Max Clarke who was clearly totally unprepared for the offload the came to him.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: hasta (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:45
Both red cards 100% red. They're trying to get players to lower their tackle height. Williams didn't do that. Rapava led with a forearm to the face.
Tip tackles basically don't happen anymore. Mid air take outs basically don't either. Red cards work to change player behaviour.
Tip tackles basically don't happen anymore. Mid air take outs basically don't either. Red cards work to change player behaviour.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:48
Quote:hasta
Both red cards 100% red. They're trying to get players to lower their tackle height. Williams didn't do that. Rapava led with a forearm to the face.
Tip tackles basically don't happen anymore. Mid air take outs basically don't either. Red cards work to change player behaviour.
I fundamentally disagree with this. They stop players from making conscious bad decisions. They don't stop players from making split second human errors.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:50
Quote:hasta
Both red cards 100% red. They're trying to get players to lower their tackle height. Williams didn't do that. Rapava led with a forearm to the face.
Tip tackles basically don't happen anymore. Mid air take outs basically don't either. Red cards work to change player behaviour.
Agree. It is ruining games to an extent, some of them do feel harsh when there is clearly no intent, it feels too easy to get sent off for the likes of me who have watched rugby for decades but your examples of changing behaviours are spot on. Kind of agree with monye, you either take head injuries seriously or you don't (and we just have to take them seriously!)
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:19:22:51:19 by charlieboa.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: hasta (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:50
Nope. The players didn't make split second decisions. They entered the tackle way too high, never tried to lower themselves. They need to change that behaviour.
No one hits harder than Underhill in our team. He is consistently low in the tackle.
No one hits harder than Underhill in our team. He is consistently low in the tackle.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: hasta (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:53
Was the game actually ruined as well? Seemed like a pretty tight game overall with the lead changing multiple times.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:53
Quote:malcoQuote:hasta
Both red cards 100% red. They're trying to get players to lower their tackle height. Williams didn't do that. Rapava led with a forearm to the face.
Tip tackles basically don't happen anymore. Mid air take outs basically don't either. Red cards work to change player behaviour.
I fundamentally disagree with this. They stop players from making conscious bad decisions. They don't stop players from making split second human errors.
10 metres back long before any last second readjustments happen in contact you decide to tackle upright or low. That is the decision that has to change.
You can still have the physical challenge.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:54
Quote:hasta
Nope. The players didn't make split second decisions. They entered the tackle way too high, never tried to lower themselves. They need to change that behaviour.
No one hits harder than Underhill in our team. He is consistently low in the tackle.
And consistently misses games through injury. All that the tinkering has done is transfer the majority of head injuries from the carrier to the tackler. But somehow that is seen as acceptable.
I'm not going to repeat the analysis of both reds I made half an hour ago. Suffice to say both were, I entreat, due to bad timing and not due to malicious intent.
Human beings will always make human errors. Punishing players for making human errors just makes the game a farce.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:19:22:58:36 by malco.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 22:56
Quote:hasta
Was the game actually ruined as well? Seemed like a pretty tight game overall with the lead changing multiple times.
Who knows how it would have looked if both teams had kept their players on the pitch.
Keep cards for intentional foul play. That was always the intention. Carding players for human error is ridiculous. You don't choose to make a human error and therefore being punished for making a human error improves nothing.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Coalminer (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 23:02
I wasn’t in disagreement with the two reds tonight.
However I saw a London Irish player get sent off last Saturday for something that was absolutely identical to the Priestland incident at Worcester.
I don’t see how we can have a situation where one week that is not even a penalty and another week it is a red card and a six week ban.
However I saw a London Irish player get sent off last Saturday for something that was absolutely identical to the Priestland incident at Worcester.
I don’t see how we can have a situation where one week that is not even a penalty and another week it is a red card and a six week ban.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: sirtidychris (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 23:06
A win is a win well done bath. I actually found the game entertaining, but yeah bath are awful, we are pretty much as good as the worst team in the prem when they have 14 men...eek. highlights for me was will muir and faletau. And despite me not being hoops biggest fan at the mo I enjoyed his post match interview where he seemed to actually be himself and not some management automaton, came across as a decent guy doing his best...whether thats good enough is for another thread, thats also discussing commentators !!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: hasta (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 23:08
Quote:malcoQuote:hasta
Was the game actually ruined as well? Seemed like a pretty tight game overall with the lead changing multiple times.
Who knows how it would have looked if both teams had kept their players on the pitch.
Keep cards for intentional foul play. That was always the intention. Carding players for human error is ridiculous. You don't choose to make a human error and therefore being punished for making a human error improves nothing.
As said, with tip tackles and mid air contact it clearly has improved things. No one's calling these malicious. What they are saying is that head injuries and concussion are an existential threat to the game and that they need to cut that out (and be seen to cut it out). So red cards.
For the last few years they've said that if you put yourself in a position that an error will cause a head contact, you'll get carded. You might disagree with that principle, but it's 100% consistent with everything else for the last few years.
Also, again, two red cards, the game was clearly not ruined.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: hemington (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 23:24
Quote:malcoQuote:P G TipsQuote:Awp24975
[
I know what the laws say, I just don’t think it was deserving of a red card that’s all.
The game faces an existential crisis with parts of the medical lobby demanding it be banned in schools and radically changed for adults to avoid head injury.
For once an official decides to apply the laws to protect a player - what would you have him do inst
PG
The problem for me is simply this.
It is human to err. Even the very best trained, most highly talented humans make human errors. There is a world of difference between deliberate foul play and making a human error.
If we are sending players off for making human errors then that is farcical because they are not choosing to make the error and therefore cannot correct that error.
The only way to stop human error is to ban the sport.
And yet we see less tip tackles, less neck roles, less tackles in the air, can't humans can learn to not make some errors that previously we thought they can't?
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: warrenball (IP Logged)
Date: 19/02/2021 23:35
Game between two very poor teams, certainly not helped by weather and lack of crowd but there is no way I would pay to watch rubbish like that once we are allowed back in. Watching Bath trying to bash their way over the try line time after time without any original or creative idea was just dull, dull, dull.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Kidney Stone (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 00:34
Grim game, but welcome the result.
Dunn and Mercer worked their socks off, and Rhys kept his head when it mattered. Faletau good too, but looked like he was nursing his wrist at one point.
Take the points and move on.
Dunn and Mercer worked their socks off, and Rhys kept his head when it mattered. Faletau good too, but looked like he was nursing his wrist at one point.
Take the points and move on.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: joethefanatic (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 00:42
Just watched the game. I'm sorry that was just cr4p. The lack of any on field leadership, or even detectable intelligence, was simply ludicrous. 70 minutes against 14 men? That should have been 5 pts. Instead, we were saved by the sending of Mike Williams which seemed to give us permission to actually play rugby. No problem with any of the cards, either - JJ should be ashamed of himself. And Tian had better be good from the tee or we'll be bottom next season without Rhys.
MotM - Josh Bayliss, heart, head and a fine step.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:20:00:45:24 by joethefanatic.
MotM - Josh Bayliss, heart, head and a fine step.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:20:00:45:24 by joethefanatic.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: The Bear (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 00:52
Both were Reds.
Sonny Bill Williams was rightly sent off against the Lions and that was a few years ago. You can't 'bounce' players off anymore. There's no excuse not to wrap the arms and there's no excuse for going at head height.
I think professional rugby's real problem is less the technique and more the relentless pursuit of bulk and the collisions that follow... but that ship has sailed and we've got the laws we've got.
I'm glad we won. Gloucester-Bath is not your typical match and I'm wary of reading too much into it. I don't know which pundit said it but Gloucester really are unbalanced - the exceptional combined with the mundane.
Sonny Bill Williams was rightly sent off against the Lions and that was a few years ago. You can't 'bounce' players off anymore. There's no excuse not to wrap the arms and there's no excuse for going at head height.
I think professional rugby's real problem is less the technique and more the relentless pursuit of bulk and the collisions that follow... but that ship has sailed and we've got the laws we've got.
I'm glad we won. Gloucester-Bath is not your typical match and I'm wary of reading too much into it. I don't know which pundit said it but Gloucester really are unbalanced - the exceptional combined with the mundane.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: abendanon-anon-anon (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 05:07
Give Rhys the Freedom of the City, so he can drive his sheep over Pultney Bridge!
What a kick to sink Glaws
What a kick to sink Glaws
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Awp (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 06:49
It wasn’t pretty, but make no mistake, winning like that will be massive for squad togetherness and confidence.
At the end of the day a win against those lot however it came about is a good result. That was pretty close to their first choice team (May and Polledri I think) so to beat them without any of the our 4 front line locks is pretty impressive. Scrummaging as a back row at lock is big difference, but they stood up just!
We ground out a win. The players will be sat in the changing room after that game absolutely buzzing. They won’t care what it looked like for us on tv and quite right. They are focussed on winning which they did, albeit just and with lots to work on, but they won.
Josh Bayliss is some player, and is becoming invaluable to us. I spent a while watching just him, and his work rate is immense. Miles Reid as well, just gets on with it and is happy to do the grind.
Faletau was brilliant. I worried when grabbed his hand thinking another long term injury, but when he is in form like that he is a joy to watch. He and Watson are our world class players and we are lucky to have them.
Rhys deserves credit for last night. Those conditions weren’t great, but he just keeps adding the points. I do think we will miss him when he’s gone more than some will realise.
There are however still too many mistakes defensively. It was better, but I was never comfortable when they had the ball attacking. Also some of the decision making last night was just wrong. I was against Dunn’s tap penalty thinking we should have taken the 3, build a 7 point lead and then go again. And then to try it again when it failed first time baffles me.
We won when not playing well and are two from two which is more than I thought from this period. Hopefully McNally will be back next week, and him and Elliott Stooke together will make a huge difference up front.
At the end of the day a win against those lot however it came about is a good result. That was pretty close to their first choice team (May and Polledri I think) so to beat them without any of the our 4 front line locks is pretty impressive. Scrummaging as a back row at lock is big difference, but they stood up just!
We ground out a win. The players will be sat in the changing room after that game absolutely buzzing. They won’t care what it looked like for us on tv and quite right. They are focussed on winning which they did, albeit just and with lots to work on, but they won.
Josh Bayliss is some player, and is becoming invaluable to us. I spent a while watching just him, and his work rate is immense. Miles Reid as well, just gets on with it and is happy to do the grind.
Faletau was brilliant. I worried when grabbed his hand thinking another long term injury, but when he is in form like that he is a joy to watch. He and Watson are our world class players and we are lucky to have them.
Rhys deserves credit for last night. Those conditions weren’t great, but he just keeps adding the points. I do think we will miss him when he’s gone more than some will realise.
There are however still too many mistakes defensively. It was better, but I was never comfortable when they had the ball attacking. Also some of the decision making last night was just wrong. I was against Dunn’s tap penalty thinking we should have taken the 3, build a 7 point lead and then go again. And then to try it again when it failed first time baffles me.
We won when not playing well and are two from two which is more than I thought from this period. Hopefully McNally will be back next week, and him and Elliott Stooke together will make a huge difference up front.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 07:52
The Williams red card could be viewed as error but R Ruskin deliberately raised and led with his forearm.
Maybe not malicious -but certainly intentional.
PG
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
Maybe not malicious -but certainly intentional.
PG
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: gaz59 (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 08:02
Quote:malcoQuote:hasta
Both red cards 100% red. They're trying to get players to lower their tackle height. Williams didn't do that. Rapava led with a forearm to the face.
Tip tackles basically don't happen anymore. Mid air take outs basically don't either. Red cards work to change player behaviour.
I fundamentally disagree with this. They stop players from making conscious bad decisions. They don't stop players from making split second human errors.
That's the job of coaching
To change the habitual action
Hasta is 100% right in my view
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: nick holder (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 08:06
I thought it was an enthralling game!
Some seem to think it was 15 v 14 for 70 mins, how can that have been the case when we had a man sent off on 50 mins?
We had no recognised locks in the squad apart from a teenager on the bench.
Most on here thought we would lose, so let us embrace the win.
Still not convinced by Hooper, but he dos seem to have energised the younger members of the squad to put their bodies on the line time after time.
A win is a win, take it and move on
Some seem to think it was 15 v 14 for 70 mins, how can that have been the case when we had a man sent off on 50 mins?
We had no recognised locks in the squad apart from a teenager on the bench.
Most on here thought we would lose, so let us embrace the win.
Still not convinced by Hooper, but he dos seem to have energised the younger members of the squad to put their bodies on the line time after time.
A win is a win, take it and move on
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 08:07
Good summary awp. As you say irrespective of performance 2 wins will build confidence and hopefully performances will come.
We mustnt underestimate just how many we were missing inc all our locks and the injury disruption during the game.
Poor game, poor performance but there were mitigating factors and I am chuffed we managed to scrape a win.
We mustnt underestimate just how many we were missing inc all our locks and the injury disruption during the game.
Poor game, poor performance but there were mitigating factors and I am chuffed we managed to scrape a win.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Awp (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 08:27
Quote:nick holder
I thought it was an enthralling game!
Some seem to think it was 15 v 14 for 70 mins, how can that have been the case when we had a man sent off on 50 mins?
We had no recognised locks in the squad apart from a teenager on the bench.
Most on here thought we would lose, so let us embrace the win.
Still not convinced by Hooper, but he dos seem to have energised the younger members of the squad to put their bodies on the line time after time.
A win is a win, take it and move on
This last bit does seem correct in the fact that the younger members do seem energised and are willing to put their bodies on the line. It could be that the ones that have had their noses put of of joint and are saying their is splits in the camp or showing discontent are the ones that have the issue with Hoops. If this is correct (have no evidence to suggest it) then so be it, I’d rather Hoops sticks to his guns and keeps building things slowly with players that want to fight and grind out things.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Bluebs (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 08:29
Quote:hasta
Nope. The players didn't make split second decisions. They entered the tackle way too high, never tried to lower themselves. They need to change that behaviour.
No one hits harder than Underhill in our team. He is consistently low in the tackle.
This is exactly right, any split second decisions are a function of the position/action taken the moments before and should be able to be avoided by more habitual change which is what they’re aiming for. If either player on the end has been knocked out, which looked eminently possible, I wonder if folks would have such views..
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: badger1664 (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 08:37
Faletaus try was nicely worked and apart from priestlands final penalty kick was the only highlight of a dreadful match . When Barnes is in charge , Bath always seem to be playing against 16 men
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: OutsideBath (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 08:45
The aim of the game is to win at all costs so it’s job done and a pat on the back to the players.
Always nice to humiliate your opponents in the process and when they are reduced to 14 so early that should have been done before we went down to 14 later.
Always nice to humiliate your opponents in the process and when they are reduced to 14 so early that should have been done before we went down to 14 later.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 08:52
Positives:
- Bayliss (again), Reid (again), Muir.
- RPs kick in the wind and under pressure
- we were playing Gloucester who are awful
- we won with a centre on the wing, 2 fly halves and 5 back rowers
- we were playing Gloucester who are awful
- Ellis back
- generally better defence
Negatives:
- inability (unwillingness) to exploit gaps in a back line that was a centre down
- (the same point really) insistence on trying repeatedly to smash into a opposition pack that was at full strength and bigger / stronger.
- some injuries when we really don't need any
- Williams ban when we really don't need any
As said by others many times above, I will take the win and move on quickly. Gloucester should thank their lucky stars there is no relegation, they are terrible I can see why they have lost 6, 7, 8(?) games on the trot.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
- Bayliss (again), Reid (again), Muir.
- RPs kick in the wind and under pressure
- we were playing Gloucester who are awful
- we won with a centre on the wing, 2 fly halves and 5 back rowers
- we were playing Gloucester who are awful
- Ellis back
- generally better defence
Negatives:
- inability (unwillingness) to exploit gaps in a back line that was a centre down
- (the same point really) insistence on trying repeatedly to smash into a opposition pack that was at full strength and bigger / stronger.
- some injuries when we really don't need any
- Williams ban when we really don't need any
As said by others many times above, I will take the win and move on quickly. Gloucester should thank their lucky stars there is no relegation, they are terrible I can see why they have lost 6, 7, 8(?) games on the trot.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 09:11
Malco, as PG Tips stated upthread, it has NEVER been legal to lead with the elbow / forearm. That has been the case for as long as I've watched the game (50 odd years). So it was a penalty offence. Then you have everything regarding head injuries, concussion and the long term health of players and it has to be red. Players need to either use a hand (not an elbow), or take the contact in the ball carrying arm as Ugo showed at HT.
When was the last time you saw Lawes, Underhill, LCD or Dunn hit someone high? Williams was less obvious but it was still should hitting the guy in the head.
Players have to learn to get their position better (lower) 1-2m out from the contact. It will come and gradually become second nature to them, in much the same way as you automatically put your seat belt on in a car without thinking.
The game cannot afford to have ex-players in their late 30s and 40s with serious brain damage.
When was the last time you saw Lawes, Underhill, LCD or Dunn hit someone high? Williams was less obvious but it was still should hitting the guy in the head.
Players have to learn to get their position better (lower) 1-2m out from the contact. It will come and gradually become second nature to them, in much the same way as you automatically put your seat belt on in a car without thinking.
The game cannot afford to have ex-players in their late 30s and 40s with serious brain damage.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Trawling (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 09:44
Entirely agree but ironically it's that age group of player armed with microphones who say 'I'd be inclined to let that go' AND who are campaigning to make game safer! I'd rather have the sensible ones on commentary ahead of the numpties from last night.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 09:51
Malco - if you think that game was ruined as a spectacle by the sending off you clearly didn’t watch the first 8 minutes. Was already littered with all the errors that point to 2 poor sides.
As for the human error argument, this is a game in which a player can be yellow-carded for not being as good as their opposite number. There are plenty of obvious improvements that can be made to the game, but condoning carelessness that leads to head injuries isn’t one of them.
As for the human error argument, this is a game in which a player can be yellow-carded for not being as good as their opposite number. There are plenty of obvious improvements that can be made to the game, but condoning carelessness that leads to head injuries isn’t one of them.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 09:52
Quote:BathMatt53
Positives:
- Bayliss (again), Reid (again), Muir.
- RPs kick in the wind and under pressure
- we were playing Gloucester who are awful
- we won with a centre on the wing, 2 fly halves and 5 back rowers
- we were playing Gloucester who are awful
- Ellis back
- generally better defence
Negatives:
- inability (unwillingness) to exploit gaps in a back line that was a centre down
- (the same point really) insistence on trying repeatedly to smash into a opposition pack that was at full strength and bigger / stronger.
- some injuries when we really don't need any
- Williams ban when we really don't need any
As said by others many times above, I will take the win and move on quickly. Gloucester should thank their lucky stars there is no relegation, they are terrible I can see why they have lost 6, 7, 8(?) games on the trot.
Agree.
Thought faletau was a positive aswell.
As you say really shouldn't take for granted nailing a pressure 45m kick in windy conditions. Rhys' goalkeeping and kicking from hand has been truly exceptional over the last year.
Agree that some decision making and giving away of daft pens in pointless ways at silly times and in crazy field positions is what does for me.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:20:09:57:14 by charlieboa.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Deckchair (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 09:54
With no relegation the result of this match was not damning or vital for either team. Bath scraped an undeserved win and so get the points. Hoorah. The rugby on show was dire, dumb and directionless and Bath need something else in their attacking repertoire apart from the shambles that is their crab-like, brain-dead five meter maul. Bath's running and off-loading try last night' was a welcome but oh so lonely spark in a continuing gloomy season. And boy do we need an on-field leader who can inspire, direct, harness and lead.
Bath may have taken the pyrrhic points last night but I suspect that Gloucester will have gained the most for the future by showing the spirit, team working and sheer guts and skills to keep a 15 man Bath pinned for most of the match with 14 men. Would that Bath could get even a taste of that.
Bath may have taken the pyrrhic points last night but I suspect that Gloucester will have gained the most for the future by showing the spirit, team working and sheer guts and skills to keep a 15 man Bath pinned for most of the match with 14 men. Would that Bath could get even a taste of that.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Bath Blues (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 10:15
Come on you lot.
Who is going to watch it again on BT Sport this morning?????
Hooper was happy with it.
Who is going to watch it again on BT Sport this morning?????
Hooper was happy with it.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: B4thB4ck (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 10:16
The Prem TV site has the match already up for viewing for those who don't have BT Sport. I will preempt someone saying the highlights editing was a breeze because so much of the game was poor, however anyone thinking there was nothing on the game and Bath are lacking spirit should take a look at the celebrations at the end.
I queried Hooper's position after the Bristol game when so many commented on a lack of effort and spirit but I don't think you win games like last night without something in the squad. We were told Glos would target the game with their selection so quality play or not, in poor conditions I can see why Hooper is delighted with a W from a scratch side.
When on a losing run you need to find a turning point from somewhere, a straw to clutch at, who would think it would be with so many changes in the last 2 games?
You take the ugly win and build from there.
I queried Hooper's position after the Bristol game when so many commented on a lack of effort and spirit but I don't think you win games like last night without something in the squad. We were told Glos would target the game with their selection so quality play or not, in poor conditions I can see why Hooper is delighted with a W from a scratch side.
When on a losing run you need to find a turning point from somewhere, a straw to clutch at, who would think it would be with so many changes in the last 2 games?
You take the ugly win and build from there.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 10:23
I'm not arguing on the substantive point about leading with the forearm. I do think he probably lifted his arm to fend and the contact happened faster than he planned for. I think it was mistimed rather than malicious.
I have no argument with punishing reckless contact with the head in order to make players choose to lower their tackle heights and contact points.
What I don't like is the idea that all contact with the head should be deemed punishable with a red card.
Players are human beings. Punish decisions they make that are reckless or consciously chosen. Do not wave red cards for human error.
I believe both red cards last night were human errors. I don't believe either were conscious acts of recklessness or aggression.
Penalty yes. Yellow yes. Red...nonsense.
I will qualify this by saying that under the current laws and sanctions they clearly were red cards. I don't blame the officials. I blame the new laws and sanctions.
I have no argument with punishing reckless contact with the head in order to make players choose to lower their tackle heights and contact points.
What I don't like is the idea that all contact with the head should be deemed punishable with a red card.
Players are human beings. Punish decisions they make that are reckless or consciously chosen. Do not wave red cards for human error.
I believe both red cards last night were human errors. I don't believe either were conscious acts of recklessness or aggression.
Penalty yes. Yellow yes. Red...nonsense.
I will qualify this by saying that under the current laws and sanctions they clearly were red cards. I don't blame the officials. I blame the new laws and sanctions.
Quote:Dorset Boy
Malco, as PG Tips stated upthread, it has NEVER been legal to lead with the elbow / forearm. That has been the case for as long as I've watched the game (50 odd years). So it was a penalty offence. Then you have everything regarding head injuries, concussion and the long term health of players and it has to be red. Players need to either use a hand (not an elbow), or take the contact in the ball carrying arm as Ugo showed at HT.
When was the last time you saw Lawes, Underhill, LCD or Dunn hit someone high? Williams was less obvious but it was still should hitting the guy in the head.
Players have to learn to get their position better (lower) 1-2m out from the contact. It will come and gradually become second nature to them, in much the same way as you automatically put your seat belt on in a car without thinking.
The game cannot afford to have ex-players in their late 30s and 40s with serious brain damage.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: B4thB4ck (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 10:28
I think Bayliss was high with the 1st red too so could have got a yellow at the same time?
That would have balanced out the red slightly for anyone thinking it was harsh.
That would have balanced out the red slightly for anyone thinking it was harsh.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 10:41
Quote:B4thB4ck
I think Bayliss was high with the 1st red too so could have got a yellow at the same time?
That would have balanced out the red slightly for anyone thinking it was harsh.
I just can't see it that way. It was a collision that happened in a split second and the point of impact took both players by surprise. Neither had time to get into the ideal position. It happens 20 times in every rugby match. Attacker moving forward at pace, defender covering across at pace, a moving target being chased down at speed by a closing defender. It is a collision sport. Collisions are inevitable. Timing errors are inevitable because humans err. The greater threat to the sport is punishing error, because that means that players get punished for being human.
The only way to guarantee that ends is to either make the sport non contact or to stop humans from playing it.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: B4thB4ck (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 10:48
Quote:malcoQuote:B4thB4ck
I think Bayliss was high with the 1st red too so could have got a yellow at the same time?
That would have balanced out the red slightly for anyone thinking it was harsh.
I just can't see it that way. It was a collision that happened in a split second and the point of impact took both players by surprise. Neither had time to get into the ideal position. It happens 20 times in every rugby match. Attacker moving forward at pace, defender covering across at pace, a moving target being chased down at speed by a closing defender. It is a collision sport. Collisions are inevitable. Timing errors are inevitable because humans err. The greater threat to the sport is punishing error, because that means that players get punished for being human.
The only way to guarantee that ends is to either make the sport non contact or to stop humans from playing it.
Maybe NASA will find some new talent on Mars. Not sure how we get them back to Earth though.
I can see your points but as others have suggested I think we need to let this play out to see where it leads as the rewards take time to come through with any change of interpretation.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: The Bear (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 11:16
Quote:malcoQuote:B4thB4ck
I think Bayliss was high with the 1st red too so could have got a yellow at the same time?
That would have balanced out the red slightly for anyone thinking it was harsh.
The only way to guarantee that ends is to either make the sport non contact or to stop humans from playing it.
In 80 minutes we had two red cards and the game actually finished and a result was recorded.
It's not like these laws are an existential threat to games. I'd prefer less reds sure but legal action arising from head injuries is a genuine existential threat to the game (and future participation).
And it's not enough to say some head injuries are unavoidable and therefore we'll do nothing about the avoidable ones.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ChippenhamRoman (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 11:43
Quote:malcoQuote:hasta
Both red cards 100% red. They're trying to get players to lower their tackle height. Williams didn't do that. Rapava led with a forearm to the face.
Tip tackles basically don't happen anymore. Mid air take outs basically don't either. Red cards work to change player behaviour.
I fundamentally disagree with this. They stop players from making conscious bad decisions. They don't stop players from making split second human errors.
It will force players to go lower. If every game loses two players a game, it will change them. Coaches and players will do it.
Back to basics with the kids. Go low, take the legs.
Then we can move on, and players might not be punch drunk by 40.
J
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 11:43
That's not what I'm saying at all.
We must clamp down on reckless and deliberate acts.
We must not punish players for human error.
We must clamp down on reckless and deliberate acts.
We must not punish players for human error.
Quote:The BearQuote:malcoQuote:B4thB4ck
I think Bayliss was high with the 1st red too so could have got a yellow at the same time?
That would have balanced out the red slightly for anyone thinking it was harsh.
The only way to guarantee that ends is to either make the sport non contact or to stop humans from playing it.
In 80 minutes we had two red cards and the game actually finished and a result was recorded.
It's not like these laws are an existential threat to games. I'd prefer less reds sure but legal action arising from head injuries is a genuine existential threat to the game (and future participation).
And it's not enough to say some head injuries are unavoidable and therefore we'll do nothing about the avoidable ones.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 11:44
Quote:ChippenhamRomanQuote:malcoQuote:hasta
Both red cards 100% red. They're trying to get players to lower their tackle height. Williams didn't do that. Rapava led with a forearm to the face.
Tip tackles basically don't happen anymore. Mid air take outs basically don't either. Red cards work to change player behaviour.
I fundamentally disagree with this. They stop players from making conscious bad decisions. They don't stop players from making split second human errors.
It will force players to go lower. If every game loses two players a game, it will change them. Coaches and players will do it.
Back to basics with the kids. Go low, take the legs.
Then we can move on, and players might not be punch drunk by 40.
J
Why are you only looking at this from the position of the tackler?
Roko got seriously injured last night. He was tackling low. It's a shoulder injury, not a head injury, but that's luck and nothing else.
The new laws and sanctions are focused on preventing head injury to carriers but seem to have zero regard for the safety of tacklers.
Going low guarantees more head and shoulder injuries for tacklers.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:20:11:46:24 by malco.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: SurreySarrie (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 11:46
I was quite surprised Shoeman didn't get red-carded too tbh. Certainly the replayed camera angle made the first point of contact look an awful lot like his shoulder and the Glaws player's face. I can't think of the last time two players were carded for the same incident from the same side?
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: bathwickboy (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 11:48
A win is a win, but as entertainment the match was dire. Yes, there was the fleeting moment of a well worked Bath try and plenty of endeavour but I would have thought it a total waste of money if I had paid to watch that. I don't know what game the BT commentators were watching when they were prattling on about a fine game of rugby to start off the weekend, it certainly was not the game between 2 very poor sides at the Rec!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Murty7 (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 12:14
The two incidents were very different. I accept that Williams made an error but the intent of the laws is to make people choose to tackle lower so errors don't lead to the head contact that means ex players like Lipman can enjoy a normal life after retiring from providing us with entertainment.
What the glos prop did was a deliberate act of foul play. You have never been able to lead with the forearm away from the body. It was not about timing or judgement as the arm should never extend like that before contact. The intent may not have been to catch the head but he definitely wanted to take the contact with an illegal extended forearm.
I hope that is reflected in the bans they get.
I understand your point about mistakes Malco but this may be my memory playing tricks but before the Rugby League coaches became involved tackles were generally lower which is why there was less head contact. Player need to be coached to think about tackling lower and then it will become the norm again. The argument about stopping offloads is irrelevant as it may make the game more open and if you watch Sam U play he tackles low and you don't see many offloads as they hit the floor so quickly. The rules that dictate that the tackled player must play the ball immediately should be enforced this would stop player lying on their back and passing to a supporting player significantly after the tackle.
What the glos prop did was a deliberate act of foul play. You have never been able to lead with the forearm away from the body. It was not about timing or judgement as the arm should never extend like that before contact. The intent may not have been to catch the head but he definitely wanted to take the contact with an illegal extended forearm.
I hope that is reflected in the bans they get.
I understand your point about mistakes Malco but this may be my memory playing tricks but before the Rugby League coaches became involved tackles were generally lower which is why there was less head contact. Player need to be coached to think about tackling lower and then it will become the norm again. The argument about stopping offloads is irrelevant as it may make the game more open and if you watch Sam U play he tackles low and you don't see many offloads as they hit the floor so quickly. The rules that dictate that the tackled player must play the ball immediately should be enforced this would stop player lying on their back and passing to a supporting player significantly after the tackle.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ChippenhamRoman (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 12:36
Quote:malcoQuote:ChippenhamRomanQuote:malcoQuote:hasta
Both red cards 100% red. They're trying to get players to lower their tackle height. Williams didn't do that. Rapava led with a forearm to the face.
Tip tackles basically don't happen anymore. Mid air take outs basically don't either. Red cards work to change player behaviour.
I fundamentally disagree with this. They stop players from making conscious bad decisions. They don't stop players from making split second human errors.
It will force players to go lower. If every game loses two players a game, it will change them. Coaches and players will do it.
Back to basics with the kids. Go low, take the legs.
Then we can move on, and players might not be punch drunk by 40.
J
Why are you only looking at this from the position of the tackler?
Roko got seriously injured last night. He was tackling low. It's a shoulder injury, not a head injury, but that's luck and nothing else.
The new laws and sanctions are focused on preventing head injury to carriers but seem to have zero regard for the safety of tacklers.
Going low guarantees more head and shoulder injuries for tacklers.
Ok, how about lowers than someone’s face?
Also, I’d rather be out with a injured shoulder than having dementia in my 50s.
I think you are fighting a losing battle here mate. The game will adjust itself. It always has.
We have seen how serious it’s becoming to players who only retired a few years ago showing some terrible symptoms.
Was chatting to an ex pro before Christmas at our rugby club and it was worrying hearing some of the stories from him personally. Memory loss, passing out, etc.
J
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:20:12:38:07 by ChippenhamRoman.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 12:46
Again though, that's only looking at half the issue.
Think of the tackler, not the carrier.
Think of Roko last night. You have a powerful player running at you at pace, stepping, high knee lift. Your job is to stop him. You have a split second to do that job.
Commit yourself low early - attacker steps you and you have failed to do your job. Coaches the world over have been focusing on the need not to do this for years immemorial.
Commit yourself late and there is a very strong chance that you are going to catch a knee, a hip or an elbow in the head.
Last night Roko covered across at pace while Rees Zamitt was stepping at pace towards the line. He was the last man and his job was to stop a crucial try from being scored If he had committed himself a fraction early he would have failed in his prime task and Rees Zamitt would have scored a match winning try.
The tackle he made would have made world rugby absolutely delighted.
The outcome is that we are very likely never to see him play in a Bath shirt again.
Think of the tackler, not the carrier.
Think of Roko last night. You have a powerful player running at you at pace, stepping, high knee lift. Your job is to stop him. You have a split second to do that job.
Commit yourself low early - attacker steps you and you have failed to do your job. Coaches the world over have been focusing on the need not to do this for years immemorial.
Commit yourself late and there is a very strong chance that you are going to catch a knee, a hip or an elbow in the head.
Last night Roko covered across at pace while Rees Zamitt was stepping at pace towards the line. He was the last man and his job was to stop a crucial try from being scored If he had committed himself a fraction early he would have failed in his prime task and Rees Zamitt would have scored a match winning try.
The tackle he made would have made world rugby absolutely delighted.
The outcome is that we are very likely never to see him play in a Bath shirt again.
Quote:ChippenhamRomanQuote:malcoQuote:ChippenhamRomanQuote:malcoQuote:hasta
Both red cards 100% red. They're trying to get players to lower their tackle height. Williams didn't do that. Rapava led with a forearm to the face.
Tip tackles basically don't happen anymore. Mid air take outs basically don't either. Red cards work to change player behaviour.
I fundamentally disagree with this. They stop players from making conscious bad decisions. They don't stop players from making split second human errors.
It will force players to go lower. If every game loses two players a game, it will change them. Coaches and players will do it.
Back to basics with the kids. Go low, take the legs.
Then we can move on, and players might not be punch drunk by 40.
J
Why are you only looking at this from the position of the tackler?
Roko got seriously injured last night. He was tackling low. It's a shoulder injury, not a head injury, but that's luck and nothing else.
The new laws and sanctions are focused on preventing head injury to carriers but seem to have zero regard for the safety of tacklers.
Going low guarantees more head and shoulder injuries for tacklers.
Ok, how about lowers than someone’s face?
Also, I’d rather be out with a injured shoulder than having dementia in my 50s.
I think you are fighting a losing battle here mate. The game will adjust itself. It always has.
We have seen how serious it’s becoming to players who only retired a few years ago showing some terrible symptoms.
Was chatting to an ex pro before Christmas at out rugby club and it was worrying hearing some of the stories from him personally. Memory loss, passing out, etc.
J
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 12:51
Murty- you are absolutely right. R League defensive coaching (& IIRC and influx of south sea island players) considerably increased the high and swinging arm tackle count in the early 00s.
I remember about that time reading a letter in the press from an orthopaedic surgeon who had done a study into season ending neck injuries in rugby (when neck rather than concussion was the big worry). He found a serious injury per 100,000 players per season in Union. In League the rate was 1 in 6,500.
In other words a League player was 15 times more likely to suffer a season ending neck injury than a Union player.
It wasn't about the intensity of the scrummaging was it?
PG
I remember about that time reading a letter in the press from an orthopaedic surgeon who had done a study into season ending neck injuries in rugby (when neck rather than concussion was the big worry). He found a serious injury per 100,000 players per season in Union. In League the rate was 1 in 6,500.
In other words a League player was 15 times more likely to suffer a season ending neck injury than a Union player.
It wasn't about the intensity of the scrummaging was it?
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: dr.bath1865 (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 12:52
A win is a win, but we played 2 minutes of good rugby out of 80... the 40th and the 80th. Nice try before half time and still amazed we showed the composure we did at the end. Chudley did well to marshall us and must admit I left the room, fully expecting to come back in to see 12T lining up a penalty.
The other 78 minutes were laughable. A bunch of excuses - no locks, backs out of position, so many leaders missing, Gloucester not actually as bad as 12th, as proven last week - but so so so far from good enough.
Both reds for me. On Williams, players have to learn to bend at the waist to tackle. Very difficult when you’re sprinting up in a kick-chase, as Williams and Sch were, but those are now the rules. Run, set yourself, bend, make tackle. Leaves you vulnerable to being stepped but I guess another upside other than safety might be a more open game, a game not dominated by huge collisions.
Derby won. Onto next week... Lord knows who we’ll be able to pick from.
The other 78 minutes were laughable. A bunch of excuses - no locks, backs out of position, so many leaders missing, Gloucester not actually as bad as 12th, as proven last week - but so so so far from good enough.
Both reds for me. On Williams, players have to learn to bend at the waist to tackle. Very difficult when you’re sprinting up in a kick-chase, as Williams and Sch were, but those are now the rules. Run, set yourself, bend, make tackle. Leaves you vulnerable to being stepped but I guess another upside other than safety might be a more open game, a game not dominated by huge collisions.
Derby won. Onto next week... Lord knows who we’ll be able to pick from.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: B4thB4ck (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 12:58
Next is a Sunday game so an extra day and a half rest from last night. Could be useful.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Old Bath Tub (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 13:53
Just a point on cards , Quin’s v Sale , currently 21-0, Sale No 6 Du Perez just given a yellow for shoulder to the head of Dombrant in a ruck clear out by ref Tempest. Consistency?
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"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
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Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: LSAR (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 13:54
Like many posters it was a frustrating and sometimes boring game to watch. But a win so that goes a long long way to making it feel a bit better, but not sure it showed much progression. Still too many errors and poor decision making basically they kept us in our own half with 14 players for what felt like an eternity, luckily Glos are not firing, as any other team would have put us to the sword with that much possession in our 22 .
What really frustrates me is when we funally get near the try line the silly pick and goes, we are just not good enough at it and it is almost inevitable we will give up a 3 point opportunity and turn over the ball after a couple of phases . The way RP is kicking just take the three and save 5 mins of
nonsense and than a turn over !
Also the commentary from Dayglo was so biased , he must hate Bath .. He spent the whole match praising Glos and really they were just as poor as us .
Strangely felt sorry for Glos DOR more than happy for SH.
What really frustrates me is when we funally get near the try line the silly pick and goes, we are just not good enough at it and it is almost inevitable we will give up a 3 point opportunity and turn over the ball after a couple of phases . The way RP is kicking just take the three and save 5 mins of
nonsense and than a turn over !
Also the commentary from Dayglo was so biased , he must hate Bath .. He spent the whole match praising Glos and really they were just as poor as us .
Strangely felt sorry for Glos DOR more than happy for SH.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 13:56
Malco, it the tacklers went for the midriff, underneath the ball more often then it would be a lot safer for them and the player they are tackling. Too many player aim above the ball and that results in head injuries and serius long term health issues.
If Lawes at 6' 9" can hit beneath the ball 99+% of the time, so too can all other players. It's all about positioning yourself correctly in the 1-2 m space before the tackle.
Shoulder injuries and wrist injuries have always been part of the game but they mend. The brain doesn't.
If Lawes at 6' 9" can hit beneath the ball 99+% of the time, so too can all other players. It's all about positioning yourself correctly in the 1-2 m space before the tackle.
Shoulder injuries and wrist injuries have always been part of the game but they mend. The brain doesn't.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 13:58
I think Wayne set the tone for the night at the first scrum after 90 seconds. He knew Bath had a makeshift pack, so chose to free kick the Bath pack for not being stable, rather than go for the rest. Total and utter lack of empathy from such an experienced ref.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 14:06
No way.
If you aim for the midriff with your shoulder you almost guarantee a knee or hip in the head.
If you aim for the midriff with your shoulder you almost guarantee a knee or hip in the head.
Quote:Dorset Boy
Malco, it the tacklers went for the midriff, underneath the ball more often then it would be a lot safer for them and the player they are tackling. Too many player aim above the ball and that results in head injuries and serius long term health issues.
If Lawes at 6' 9" can hit beneath the ball 99+% of the time, so too can all other players. It's all about positioning yourself correctly in the 1-2 m space before the tackle.
Shoulder injuries and wrist injuries have always been part of the game but they mend. The brain doesn't.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 14:08
Quote:malco
No way.
If you aim for the midriff with your shoulder you almost guarantee a knee or hip in the head.
Quote:Dorset Boy
Malco, it the tacklers went for the midriff, underneath the ball more often then it would be a lot safer for them and the player they are tackling. Too many player aim above the ball and that results in head injuries and serius long term health issues.
If Lawes at 6' 9" can hit beneath the ball 99+% of the time, so too can all other players. It's all about positioning yourself correctly in the 1-2 m space before the tackle.
Shoulder injuries and wrist injuries have always been part of the game but they mend. The brain doesn't.
Sorry, but that's nonsense Malco. Of course you don't.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 14:14
Yes you do, if you are tackling a fast moving player from front on.
That's exactly what happened to Roko last night.
As I speak Will Evans has just sustained a nasty looking shoulder injury for Quins in an almost carbon copy of Roko's injury.
That's exactly what happened to Roko last night.
As I speak Will Evans has just sustained a nasty looking shoulder injury for Quins in an almost carbon copy of Roko's injury.
Quote:Dorset BoyQuote:malco
No way.
If you aim for the midriff with your shoulder you almost guarantee a knee or hip in the head.
Quote:Dorset Boy
Malco, it the tacklers went for the midriff, underneath the ball more often then it would be a lot safer for them and the player they are tackling. Too many player aim above the ball and that results in head injuries and serius long term health issues.
If Lawes at 6' 9" can hit beneath the ball 99+% of the time, so too can all other players. It's all about positioning yourself correctly in the 1-2 m space before the tackle.
Shoulder injuries and wrist injuries have always been part of the game but they mend. The brain doesn't.
Sorry, but that's nonsense Malco. Of course you don't.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 14:23
Really need to go for touch rugby now then!
Upright tackling is unsustainable, I really don't care is they offload in the tackle it keeps the game going. Malco is partially right you do get injuries going low but the ones going high are going to lead to the end of tackling rugby if they continue. Starting from kids rugby up.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Upright tackling is unsustainable, I really don't care is they offload in the tackle it keeps the game going. Malco is partially right you do get injuries going low but the ones going high are going to lead to the end of tackling rugby if they continue. Starting from kids rugby up.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 14:32
Its worth looking at the alternative techniques used by the lighter backs, noticed it more an more recently, Priestland, Ford and some 9s. It only works where there are a few other players around. They stay upright and push the player off with extended arms doesn't stop them dead but they then get snaffled up by surrounding forwards.
TDG uses it as well.
Edit: Alternatively it could be seen as just being a bit wimpy.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:20:14:40:32 by shipwrecked.
TDG uses it as well.
Edit: Alternatively it could be seen as just being a bit wimpy.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:20:14:40:32 by shipwrecked.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 15:59
Wiese red card for Leicester far more clear cut. Charging into a ruck, arm tucked so no attempt to bind, leading with his shoulder, direct contact with a Wasps player at the back of the ruck who isn't bound or competing with the ball. Absolutely no complaints. Stupid, reckless and unnecessary.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 16:10
Kieran Brookes now given a red card for Wasps in similar circumstances to Williams last night. Farcical.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: TomReagan (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 16:11
Quote:Presumably there comes a point when someone has to make a tackle sw-seems like passing the buck to me!shipwrecked
Its worth looking at the alternative techniques used by the lighter backs, noticed it more an more recently, Priestland, Ford and some 9s. It only works where there are a few other players around. They stay upright and push the player off with extended arms doesn't stop them dead but they then get snaffled up by surrounding forwards.
TDG uses it as well.
Edit: Alternatively it could be seen as just being a bit wimpy.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 16:15
Quote:malco
Kieran Brookes now given a red card for Wasps in similar circumstances to Williams last night. Farcical.
He had his arm tucked in so no effort to make a legal tackle.
That shoulder then hit the Tiger in the head.
It was reckless and dangerous so red.
Had he been lower with his right arm out, at worst it would have yellow.
Again bad technique that is illegal.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 16:17
Quote:TomReaganQuote:Presumably there comes a point when someone has to make a tackle sw-seems like passing the buck to me!shipwrecked
Its worth looking at the alternative techniques used by the lighter backs, noticed it more an more recently, Priestland, Ford and some 9s. It only works where there are a few other players around. They stay upright and push the player off with extended arms doesn't stop them dead but they then get snaffled up by surrounding forwards.
TDG uses it as well.
Edit: Alternatively it could be seen as just being a bit wimpy.
Probably right Tom however, some players, usually backs still make tackles but don't get HIAs and don't get red cards, all the red cards this weekend are forwards.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 16:25
Quote:Dorset BoyQuote:malco
Kieran Brookes now given a red card for Wasps in similar circumstances to Williams last night. Farcical.
He had his arm tucked in so no effort to make a legal tackle.
That shoulder then hit the Tiger in the head.
It was reckless and dangerous so red.
Had he been lower with his right arm out, at worst it would have yellow.
Again bad technique that is illegal.
Not how I saw it at all. He has come in to make the tackle. A team mate has made the tackle a split second before him causing the carrier to go down and preventing Brookes from being able to get his arm up to wrap. All happened in a split second. Very similar to what happened with Schoeman and Williams last night. Mistimed, not reckless and not an attempt to hit high.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: westglos (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 16:31
Quote:malco
That is a good result with the strength of the respective sides. Gloucester near full strength, Bath missing most of the first choice pack.
.
Malco - we were without the following who would be in our first choice squad: Woodward, May, Alemanno, Polledri, Morgan, Carreras, Singleton and Evans.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Dorset Boy (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 16:54
Another Tigers red for badly taking Bassett out in the air.
3 reds at Welford Road for the second time.
3 reds at Welford Road for the second time.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 16:58
Quote:Dorset Boy
Another Tigers red for badly taking Bassett out in the air.
3 reds at Welford Road for the second time.
Another that I have no quibble with!
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 17:04
CMK debating whether the landing should determine sanction is just odd. Catcher is rotated 180o at the top of his jump.
I really feel refs milk the red card decision procedure.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
I really feel refs milk the red card decision procedure.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Mike the Taxi (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 17:17
[www.somersetlive.co.uk] - Players' Ratings
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Awp (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 17:42
Quote:malcoQuote:Dorset BoyQuote:malco
Kieran Brookes now given a red card for Wasps in similar circumstances to Williams last night. Farcical.
He had his arm tucked in so no effort to make a legal tackle.
That shoulder then hit the Tiger in the head.
It was reckless and dangerous so red.
Had he been lower with his right arm out, at worst it would have yellow.
Again bad technique that is illegal.
Not how I saw it at all. He has come in to make the tackle. A team mate has made the tackle a split second before him causing the carrier to go down and preventing Brookes from being able to get his arm up to wrap. All happened in a split second. Very similar to what happened with Schoeman and Williams last night. Mistimed, not reckless and not an attempt to hit high.
100% this. Brookes, and the two last night yellow, the other two red all day long.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: sid the seagull (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 20:42
Hasta, SWrecked, Dboy completely agree, Malco sorry you’re just wrong. We need to stop talking or splitting quibblesome hairs and pretending they’re matters of principle.
The only matter of principle here is to change to an instinctive ‘go low’.
SQUAWK
The only matter of principle here is to change to an instinctive ‘go low’.
SQUAWK
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: gaz59 (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 21:57
Quote:malcoQuote:Dorset BoyQuote:malco
Kieran Brookes now given a red card for Wasps in similar circumstances to Williams last night. Farcical.
He had his arm tucked in so no effort to make a legal tackle.
That shoulder then hit the Tiger in the head.
It was reckless and dangerous so red.
Had he been lower with his right arm out, at worst it would have yellow.
Again bad technique that is illegal.
Not how I saw it at all. He has come in to make the tackle. A team mate has made the tackle a split second before him causing the carrier to go down and preventing Brookes from being able to get his arm up to wrap. All happened in a split second. Very similar to what happened with Schoeman and Williams last night. Mistimed, not reckless and not an attempt to hit high.
Malco, on this issue you are simply wrong
As with other dangerous stuff in the game it has nothing to do with intent/attempt or accidental/mistimed. The responsibility is on the player going into the collision to ensure they do so safely. If not, for whatever reason then it is dangerous play and an offence
Quite rightly the authorities of the game are ruling out play that research shows has massive short and long term impact on quality of life. Players and coaches have a duty to respond and comply or the game gets banned.
Harking back to the good ole days of thumping or raking, y'know when real rugby men were men and anone else got trampled on is not an option. Even football now is questioning the wisdom of allowing the long term effects from the impact of heading the ball
Refs need to consistently deal out red cards for these kind of offences. Coaches will get the message and players actions will change.
We then get a faster, more exciting, open and healthier game
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: warrenball (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 22:42
The coaches will soon get the message, these sort of tackles have got to go from the game.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Beergoggles (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 23:53
Quote:warrenball
The coaches will soon get the message, these sort of tackles have got to go from the game.
+1.... and presumably that is the game’s intent. Zero tolerance, a plethora of reds and a change in behaviour all round. As long as it’s enforced consistently it’s hard to argue with.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: stephen4944 (IP Logged)
Date: 20/02/2021 23:56
Quote:Murty7
The argument about stopping offloads is irrelevant as it may make the game more open and if you watch Sam U play he tackles low and you don't see many offloads as they hit the floor so quickly. The rules that dictate that the tackled player must play the ball immediately should be enforced this would stop player lying on their back and passing to a supporting player significantly after the tackle.
I absolutely support your second point here, re playing the ball on the ground. Players are penalised for moving with the ball after being tackled, tackling a player whilst on the floor, why are they seemingly always allowed to sit on the floor, hold onto the ball for seconds, then throw it up to supporting players, so they don't have to slow down their run?
Also, even if tackling lower does allow more offloads: 1, that benefits all teams with the ball, so hopefully more running rugby; 2, that requires supporting players to be available to take an offload; and 3 an offload is less easy to complete than a normal tackle, so more prone to a handling error anyway, either by the offloader or recieving player.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: exbathballboy (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 05:21
Sounds like Reid and Bayliss were massive, not to mention Mercer, Faletau, Dunn
The Somerset player rating article mentioned how Reid has all the components to be potentially one of the leading flankers in the Premiership. Bayliss made some strong carriers again.
I remember reading how Reid was the strongest in the squad at one point, before his serious injury.
Tall, strong, and broke the 15 tackles bar again two weeks in a row. Very committed.
The Somerset player rating article mentioned how Reid has all the components to be potentially one of the leading flankers in the Premiership. Bayliss made some strong carriers again.
I remember reading how Reid was the strongest in the squad at one point, before his serious injury.
Tall, strong, and broke the 15 tackles bar again two weeks in a row. Very committed.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 07:40
Not sure how far bayliss and Reid can go. Not convinced any parts of their game are exceptional but they are very good at most things.
Their workmate/engines and commitment are fantastic. Kind of hoping they just become excellent, consistent bath club men we can rely on. Have loved watching their improvement over recent months, both becoming big assets
Their workmate/engines and commitment are fantastic. Kind of hoping they just become excellent, consistent bath club men we can rely on. Have loved watching their improvement over recent months, both becoming big assets
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 10:07
Regarding Bayliss and Reid, you already stated their exceptional qualites Charlie, 'workrate and speed'.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: FourSticks (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 12:16
If Reid can channel his inner Roger Spurrell, then he could be the best asset Bath has had for decades. And if the furthest he can go is to be a gnarly, genuine leader, whom the players would follow over hot coals, then that would be more than enough for me.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 12:19
Quote:shipwrecked
Regarding Bayliss and Reid, you already stated their exceptional qualites Charlie, 'workrate and speed'.
Yeah fair play. Bayliss especially is seriously rapid.
I guess I meant more 'point of difference' to put them into the potential England international category.
Someone like Willis is freakishly good at the breakdown.
Vunipola can make yards in very heavy traffic consistently.
Earl (and simmonds) are lightning quick with a step that can embarrass the best backs around.
Curry is just exceptional in every facet.
I would obviously be delighted if they prove me wrong and they may well do. I would be equally delighted if they are 'just ' fantastic club men for bath whose main priority is winning trophies for their home club.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 12:33
All valid points Charlie, I actually rate speed around the pitch very high, particularly for the back row. Out of Reid, Bayliss, Underhill, Mercer, Faletau, and Ellis. I'd suggest ignoring injuries Reid and Bayliss are right up there in front of a couple of internationals even.
Lets face it how many back row forwards of that speed can also go to lock and hold their own. They will only get better.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Lets face it how many back row forwards of that speed can also go to lock and hold their own. They will only get better.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 12:49
Gaz, there are all sorts of things we don't agree on but I wouldn't tell you that you are wrong to support the Labour Party or remaining in the EU.
My views on this matter are formed by more than 40 years playing, coaching, refereeing and supporting the game.
You may not agree with me and that's fine. You might want to argue your view with passion and that's fine. Don't tell me that my opinion is wrong though. That speaks far more of you than me.
My views on this matter are formed by more than 40 years playing, coaching, refereeing and supporting the game.
You may not agree with me and that's fine. You might want to argue your view with passion and that's fine. Don't tell me that my opinion is wrong though. That speaks far more of you than me.
Quote:gaz59Quote:malcoQuote:Dorset BoyQuote:malco
Kieran Brookes now given a red card for Wasps in similar circumstances to Williams last night. Farcical.
He had his arm tucked in so no effort to make a legal tackle.
That shoulder then hit the Tiger in the head.
It was reckless and dangerous so red.
Had he been lower with his right arm out, at worst it would have yellow.
Again bad technique that is illegal.
Not how I saw it at all. He has come in to make the tackle. A team mate has made the tackle a split second before him causing the carrier to go down and preventing Brookes from being able to get his arm up to wrap. All happened in a split second. Very similar to what happened with Schoeman and Williams last night. Mistimed, not reckless and not an attempt to hit high.
Malco, on this issue you are simply wrong
As with other dangerous stuff in the game it has nothing to do with intent/attempt or accidental/mistimed. The responsibility is on the player going into the collision to ensure they do so safely. If not, for whatever reason then it is dangerous play and an offence
Quite rightly the authorities of the game are ruling out play that research shows has massive short and long term impact on quality of life. Players and coaches have a duty to respond and comply or the game gets banned.
Harking back to the good ole days of thumping or raking, y'know when real rugby men were men and anone else got trampled on is not an option. Even football now is questioning the wisdom of allowing the long term effects from the impact of heading the ball
Refs need to consistently deal out red cards for these kind of offences. Coaches will get the message and players actions will change.
We then get a faster, more exciting, open and healthier game
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ballsout (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 14:50
Ah the old "I've played, coached, supported, cleaned boots and driven the coach for 87 years so my view is more important" thing.
Anyway, decent win. Beat Saints and we can maybe say we've started to turn a corner.
Anyway, decent win. Beat Saints and we can maybe say we've started to turn a corner.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 15:06
Quote:ballsout
Ah the old "I've played, coached, supported, cleaned boots and driven the coach for 87 years so my view is more important" thing.
Anyway, decent win. Beat Saints and we can maybe say we've started to turn a corner.
Ah the old "pretend he has say something completely different to what he actually said in order to make him look bad" thing.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: hasta (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 18:47
That's enough of that please.
Regardless of anyone's opinion on this, this is how the laws of the game are interpreted, consistently, at the moment. So, players need to play the game to the laws and how they are refereed.
Regardless of anyone's opinion on this, this is how the laws of the game are interpreted, consistently, at the moment. So, players need to play the game to the laws and how they are refereed.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 18:53
Quote:hasta
That's enough of that please.
Regardless of anyone's opinion on this, this is how the laws of the game are interpreted, consistently, at the moment. So, players need to play the game to the laws and how they are refereed.
Absolutely and as I said I have no issue with the match officials and I entirely understand that under the new laws and sanctions each of these was indeed a red card incident.
However players will always make errors because they are human beings and all human beings make errors, no matter how talented or well trained they are.
So we now have a game that sends people off for being human.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: hasta (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 19:24
Yes, human beings make errors. Warburton made an error tip-tackling Clerc. Red card in an RWC semi-final. The prevalence of those tip-tackle errors has dropped to almost zero.
The point here is that if you play in such a way that such an error could cause head contact then you're at risk of a red. Adjust your play in such a way that such an error is less likely to occur.
Honestly, next thing you'll be saying that Neil Back meant to push Steve Lander and it wasn't just an error that he mistook him for Andy Robinson.
The point here is that if you play in such a way that such an error could cause head contact then you're at risk of a red. Adjust your play in such a way that such an error is less likely to occur.
Honestly, next thing you'll be saying that Neil Back meant to push Steve Lander and it wasn't just an error that he mistook him for Andy Robinson.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: joethefanatic (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 21:40
Quote:malcoQuote:hasta
That's enough of that please.
Regardless of anyone's opinion on this, this is how the laws of the game are interpreted, consistently, at the moment. So, players need to play the game to the laws and how they are refereed.
Absolutely and as I said I have no issue with the match officials and I entirely understand that under the new laws and sanctions each of these was indeed a red card incident.
However players will always make errors because they are human beings and all human beings make errors, no matter how talented or well trained they are.
So we now have a game that sends people off for being human.
Hasn't that always been the case?
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 21:43
No. Red cards were originally brought in solely for deliberate acts of serious foul play. That was the definition.
Quote:joethefanaticQuote:malcoQuote:hasta
That's enough of that please.
Regardless of anyone's opinion on this, this is how the laws of the game are interpreted, consistently, at the moment. So, players need to play the game to the laws and how they are refereed.
Absolutely and as I said I have no issue with the match officials and I entirely understand that under the new laws and sanctions each of these was indeed a red card incident.
However players will always make errors because they are human beings and all human beings make errors, no matter how talented or well trained they are.
So we now have a game that sends people off for being human.
Hasn't that always been the case?
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: joethefanatic (IP Logged)
Date: 21/02/2021 21:49
Quote:malco
No. Red cards were originally brought in solely for deliberate acts of serious foul play. That was the definition.Quote:joethefanaticQuote:malcoQuote:hasta
That's enough of that please.
Regardless of anyone's opinion on this, this is how the laws of the game are interpreted, consistently, at the moment. So, players need to play the game to the laws and how they are refereed.
Absolutely and as I said I have no issue with the match officials and I entirely understand that under the new laws and sanctions each of these was indeed a red card incident.
However players will always make errors because they are human beings and all human beings make errors, no matter how talented or well trained they are.
So we now have a game that sends people off for being human.
Hasn't that always been the case?
True, but there were sendings off before there were red cards. I was once sent off for swearing, sotto voce, at my scrum half. A school match, admittedly.
... IMHO, of course.
Now in Honolulu
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:02:21:21:52:24 by joethefanatic.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ballsout (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 10:10
It's amusing seeing Malco ignore the very pertinent argument from half a dozen different posters about tip tackles and mid-air tackles being far less frequent, every single time, because it completely destroys his deluded argument.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 10:23
Quote:ballsout
It's amusing seeing Malco ignore the very pertinent argument from half a dozen different posters about tip tackles and mid-air tackles being far less frequent, every single time, because it completely destroys his deluded argument.
Ballsout, please stop. Its like you are deliberately targeting Malco to drive him away again. Its really childish IMO.
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 10:33
Thank you Matt.
ballsout - you were asked to stop yesterday by hasta.
Take heed.
PG
ballsout - you were asked to stop yesterday by hasta.
Take heed.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ballsout (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 10:49
Quote:P G Tips
ballsout - you were asked to stop yesterday by hasta.
I was?
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ballsout (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 10:53
Personally what I find annoying is someone so stubborn that they're unable to engage with or even acknowledge a simple pertinent argument, even when it's put to them half a dozen times. That blinkered attitude is more annoying and detrimental to actual reasoned discourse than me calling out his terrible takes on a couple of occasions. Red cards for non malicious tip tackles and mid air tackles HAVE had a noticeable effect on the frequency of them, the same will be true with contact to the head.
But sure I'll calm it down and simply smile when I see his posts.
But sure I'll calm it down and simply smile when I see his posts.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 11:03
Quote:ballsout
Personally what I find annoying is someone so stubborn that they're unable to engage with or even acknowledge a simple pertinent argument, even when it's put to them half a dozen times. That blinkered attitude is more annoying and detrimental to actual reasoned discourse than me calling out his terrible takes on a couple of occasions. Red cards for non malicious tip tackles and mid air tackles HAVE had a noticeable effect on the frequency of them, the same will be true with contact to the head.
But sure I'll calm it down and simply smile when I see his posts.
Fundamentally then, anybody who has a different view to you is a legitimate target of abuse.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 11:07
To be fair that same argument could me made in relation to quite a number of people on this board!
I am in agreement with the point that reds are needed, even if it spoils a few games at the moment. My two sons play age grade rugby and I want this issue minimised as far as possibly by the time they reach adult rugby.
I find it odd / confusing about the point of contact thing. I have seen this season some refs saying 'he landed on his hands so yellow', some saying 'if he hadn't put his arms out then it would have been head, so red' (the last Tigers one that the weekend). The tip tackle yesterday would have been on head if he hadn't tucked it in. So are we ignoring the players actions who tries to not fall on his head, or are they taken into account?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
I am in agreement with the point that reds are needed, even if it spoils a few games at the moment. My two sons play age grade rugby and I want this issue minimised as far as possibly by the time they reach adult rugby.
I find it odd / confusing about the point of contact thing. I have seen this season some refs saying 'he landed on his hands so yellow', some saying 'if he hadn't put his arms out then it would have been head, so red' (the last Tigers one that the weekend). The tip tackle yesterday would have been on head if he hadn't tucked it in. So are we ignoring the players actions who tries to not fall on his head, or are they taken into account?
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: ballsout (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 11:13
Quote:malcoQuote:ballsout
Personally what I find annoying is someone so stubborn that they're unable to engage with or even acknowledge a simple pertinent argument, even when it's put to them half a dozen times. That blinkered attitude is more annoying and detrimental to actual reasoned discourse than me calling out his terrible takes on a couple of occasions. Red cards for non malicious tip tackles and mid air tackles HAVE had a noticeable effect on the frequency of them, the same will be true with contact to the head.
But sure I'll calm it down and simply smile when I see his posts.
Fundamentally then, anybody who has a different view to you is a legitimate target of abuse.
Read what I wrote again. That's not what I'm saying. Do you deliberately mis-read posts and/or put words in people's mouths or is it an unconscious thing?
I said that someone who ignores a comment that's repeated by many people, one that dismantles their argument, is worth calling out.
And there's no "abuse" here. Please.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Malco (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 11:17
Nothing has "dismantled" my argument.
That is just your view, which doesn't coincide with my view. We are not the only people who hold these respective views. I don't have any enmity towards people who see it the same way that you see it, I just disagree and believe what I believe.
The only person dishing out rudeness and scorn here is you. You have already deliberately warped my comments to put your own agenda on them and then accused me of doing that when I haven't.
You won't change my mind and clearly I won't change yours. I won't stoop to your level of behaviour in demanding that I should.
That is just your view, which doesn't coincide with my view. We are not the only people who hold these respective views. I don't have any enmity towards people who see it the same way that you see it, I just disagree and believe what I believe.
The only person dishing out rudeness and scorn here is you. You have already deliberately warped my comments to put your own agenda on them and then accused me of doing that when I haven't.
You won't change my mind and clearly I won't change yours. I won't stoop to your level of behaviour in demanding that I should.
Quote:ballsoutQuote:malcoQuote:ballsout
Personally what I find annoying is someone so stubborn that they're unable to engage with or even acknowledge a simple pertinent argument, even when it's put to them half a dozen times. That blinkered attitude is more annoying and detrimental to actual reasoned discourse than me calling out his terrible takes on a couple of occasions. Red cards for non malicious tip tackles and mid air tackles HAVE had a noticeable effect on the frequency of them, the same will be true with contact to the head.
But sure I'll calm it down and simply smile when I see his posts.
Fundamentally then, anybody who has a different view to you is a legitimate target of abuse.
Read what I wrote again. That's not what I'm saying. Do you deliberately mis-read posts and/or put words in people's mouths or is it an unconscious thing?
I said that someone who ignores a comment that's repeated by many people, one that dismantles their argument, is worth calling out.
And there's no "abuse" here. Please.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: hasta (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 11:18
Stop now. Both of you.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 11:24
Quote:BathMatt53
I find it odd / confusing about the point of contact thing. I have seen this season some refs saying 'he landed on his hands so yellow', some saying 'if he hadn't put his arms out then it would have been head, so red' (the last Tigers one that the weekend). The tip tackle yesterday would have been on head if he hadn't tucked it in. So are we ignoring the players actions who tries to not fall on his head, or are they taken into account?
I agree Matt, if this weekend is affirmation of a "protect the head" policy then it needs clarifying quickly.
If you are coming down head first there are many reasons why an arm out might not break your fall. These cards are mostly forwards, most forwards are around 15 stone add in a bit of kinetic energy and you are talking about significant forces here.
Even the tacklers who is in contact with them and usually a big forward as well fail to be "responsible for the safe landing of the individuals" usually fail to do so. If you rotate a player through 180o its dangerous. Should be red.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: gaz59 (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 11:48
Quote:hasta
Stop now. Both of you.
Go on Hasta, bang their heads together and send them up to their rooms, please
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: hasta (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 11:52
Quote:gaz59Quote:hasta
Stop now. Both of you.
Go on Hasta, bang their heads together and send them up to their rooms, please
That would be a red card offence, it's a coaching point to start lower.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: gaz59 (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 12:58
Quote:hastaQuote:gaz59Quote:hasta
Stop now. Both of you.
Go on Hasta, bang their heads together and send them up to their rooms, please
That would be a red card offence, it's a coaching point to start lower.
OK, well let them have their supper first and then go to the naughty step until they've said sorry
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Disunited (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 15:09
Bears reporting Sam Bedlow of Bristol Bears is now going up before the beak for his tip tackle.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 15:17
Quote:Disunited
Bears reporting Sam Bedlow of Bristol Bears is now going up before the beak for his tip tackle.
Not really surprising, would Bristol have still got a draw playing 75ish minutes with 14 men?
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 15:18
Quote:shipwreckedQuote:Disunited
Bears reporting Sam Bedlow of Bristol Bears is now going up before the beak for his tip tackle.
Not really surprising, would Bristol have still got a draw playing 75ish minutes with 14 men?
The scored more with 14 men than 15, so they probably would have won by 50!
[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 15:22
Quote:BathMatt53Quote:shipwreckedQuote:Disunited
Bears reporting Sam Bedlow of Bristol Bears is now going up before the beak for his tip tackle.
Not really surprising, would Bristol have still got a draw playing 75ish minutes with 14 men?
The scored more with 14 men than 15, so they probably would have won by 50!
Could well be true Matt as they probably wouldn't have withdrawn their key players. I notice Calum Sheedy isn't that pleased about the second half capitulation either.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: Rawce (IP Logged)
Date: 22/02/2021 16:12
Quote:Don’t worry, they’ll be back in school on the 8th March.hasta
Stop now. Both of you.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 25/02/2021 21:13
Quote:AwpQuote:Mike the Taxi
Wayne Barnes awards red card to Glos Ruskin fowl play against Baylis!
Harsh red, benefits us but was as a result of a poor tackle from Bayliss.
I’ve just caught up with Rugby Tonight. Nigel Owens confirms all 5 red cards at weekend absolutely correct.
Also- on Ch5 higjlights Flatman clear that “high tackler position does not justify elbow into chops”. Again all red cards justified. Borthwick confirmed the same from Leicester: Wasps match.
That’s how the professionals see it.
PG
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 25/02/2021 21:18
Out of interest did he mention Bedlow's tip tackle PG?
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 25/02/2021 21:29
Not specifically & I did not check Bristol match in the Ch5 highlights so din’t know Flats view.
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
P G Tips
Jaco Coetzee: my adopted Player, 2023-24.
Re: PLAYING FOR PRIDE. BATH v GLOUCESTER. TEAM UP!
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 25/02/2021 21:58
No problem, just wondered but given that even Bedlow thought it was red I wondered if Nigel mentioned it. Thanks.
Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.
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