A new option for a new ground?

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"It would be fitting if some of that funding could be used to help secure the future of the Town's football team and place us back in the heart of our local community."

Except that Tranmere Rovers is not just for Birkenhead its for Wirral.

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Tranmere are a Birkenhead team that draw their support from across the Wirral peninsula.

The whole footprint of the market site is a little smaller than that currently occupied by the stadium (pitch and stands) itself I think. Given that the access roads around it are needed for supplies to and from the shops and offer little chance to widen the footprint, without very expensive alterations at least, it is not really feasible for a new stadium. I would also anticipate that the cost of the ground to purchase would be far greater than a less central site at Bidston or similar. There is land on the riverfront too near Lairds and Hamilton Square though I am not sure these are viable. Part of the reason for a new ground is to maximise the revenue from a stadium land so it brings in money all year round. Adding retail around the stadium is a good way of doing that so hence why out of town grounds are popular.

Tranmere might well be Wirral's club, but they are from Birkenhead. That is its local community, town and, in my experience where the vast majority of fans are come from. And I say this as someone who is not, and never has been, a Birkenhead resident personally.

What about the newfangled fan park and micro brewery? Personally, I don't see a new stadium any time soon.

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E L V I S
What about the newfangled fan park and micro brewery? Personally, I don't see a new stadium any time soon.

That was designed in a kit form to be easy to move to a new site I believe. Still its a good few years off yet.

A new modern ground built in conjunction with either a business such as Asda, Tesco, Aldi similar to Saints Totally Wicked that can be used as a multi purpose venue in a more accessible location by train, bus & motorway is an absolute must, perhaps somewhere around the Bromborough industrial estate by Lucas sports fields or perhaps a joint venture with WBC after a review of there estate at The Oval that amalgamates the Boroughs leisure facilities and provides a new running track, pool, 3G etc etc. Either way PP is Old Hat part of the forgotten era of football, it's expensive to run requires an complete overhaul as the last development was done on the cheap and sits on Prime real estate fit for a housing development that would secure the clubs immediate future.

Sorry it ain't prime real estate, it is just outside the commercial zone so residential only. Demolition and clearance costs would be huge.
The three sides of the 1990's are fine and don't expect better in any new build. What I used to call the new stand is the issue, you should have seen the old one.
The Cop26 on the OS states some needed work is not viable as a move is the answer.

Surely we can get an iconic waterfront site with hotel etc not another industrial estate warehouse?

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bedfordave
Surely we can get an iconic waterfront site with hotel etc not another industrial estate warehouse?

Like the Old Tower Athletic Ground in New Brighton ? It’s been a league ground before (in the 1890s) although the site of the stadium itself is built over, but still a pitch and room for development next door. Pretty iconic place but would probably upset a lot of people in New Brighton !!

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bedfordave
Sorry it ain't prime real estate, it is just outside the commercial zone so residential only. Demolition and clearance costs would be huge.
The three sides of the 1990's are fine and don't expect better in any new build. What I used to call the new stand is the issue, you should have seen the old one.
The Cop26 on the OS states some needed work is not viable as a move is the answer.

Surely we can get an iconic
waterfront site with hotel etc not another industrial estate warehouse?

One day we will be going to Prenton Aldi saying Tranmere used to play here.

The way things could turn out, Bidston tip could be levelled off and a stadium could be build on that.

Then one day some old bloke could come on here, complaining that he didn't know what was worse, the rubbish on the pitch or the rubbish under it

Then I ate his Liver.......... with some baked beans and a can of coke.

Bumpers lane Chester joke

I'm not quite sure who would buy the site tbh. I cannot see a supermarket opening there and it's too small for a large housing development.

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the kav
I'm not quite sure who would buy the site tbh. I cannot see a supermarket opening there and it's too small for a large housing development.

The footprint of the ground, when you include the car park and the playing surface is pretty large. If you put a range of mixed units on it, including low rise flats, you could probably make a pretty decent profit.

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Bored rover

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bedfordave
Sorry it ain't prime real estate, it is just outside the commercial zone so residential only. Demolition and clearance costs would be huge.
The three sides of the 1990's are fine and don't expect better in any new build. What I used to call the new stand is the issue, you should have seen the old one.
The Cop26 on the OS states some needed work is not viable as a move is the answer.

Surely we can get an iconic
waterfront site with hotel etc not another industrial estate warehouse?

One day we will be going to Prenton Aldi saying Tranmere used to play here.

That was the plan in 1980 but we are outside retail planning about 50 yds!!!

Housing is fine and bigger than Ingleborough but clearance is a huge cost

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CleeHillRoadROAR

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bedfordave
Surely we can get an iconic waterfront site with hotel etc not another industrial estate warehouse?

Like the Old Tower Athletic Ground in New Brighton ? It’s been a league ground before (in the 1890s) although the site of the stadium itself is built over, but still a pitch and room for development next door. Pretty iconic place but would probably upset a lot of people in New Brighton !!

I wonder if there's anyone posting on here who remembers New Brighton playing at Rake Lane? There seems to be very little info or pictures on the rakers original home.

There’s a video on youtube with Pathé’s footage of New Brighton playing in the FA Cup in 1928 at Sandhey’s Park where they played in the 20s and 30s (but was bombed out in the war).

New Brighton FA Cup 1928

Used to watch our reserves play them in cheshire league .as kids we would go in the arcades in vicky rd tilt pennies out the machines and leg it round to rake lane .

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Zint

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the kav
I'm not quite sure who would buy the site tbh. I cannot see a supermarket opening there and it's too small for a large housing development.

The footprint of the ground, when you include the car park and the playing surface is pretty large. If you put a range of mixed units on it, including low rise flats, you could probably make a pretty decent profit.

The whole site is pretty similar in size to my old school (Bromborough Secondary), which was sold to Morris Homes by WBC. Eventually at the end of Phase 3, they are reputed to receive the final instalment of the deal to the agreed selling price of 10Million.

All demolition costs adjacent infrastructure works costs were borne by the developer.

If a new ground ever became a reality, I don't believe there would be a shortage of interested housing developers.

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gloucester white
I wonder if there's anyone posting on here who remembers New Brighton playing at Rake Lane? There seems to be very little info or pictures on the rakers original home.

Couple of good photos here: [twitter.com]

There have been 2 New Brighton clubs in the league. The first - a manufactured and basically franchise club - played at the Tower Ground but only lasted a couple of years. They may have been founder members of Div 2 ( not sure on that but similar period). The second, which is the version known as the Rakers and came up through the local leagues like Rovers - played off Rake Lane until it was bombed and then redevopled as housing post WW2. They then moved to the Tower Ground until they went bust in the mid 50s. They didn't actually play at the Tower Ground that long really.

To my understanding, as I read if it off a website once, which was some years ago and I may be remembering the detail a bit wrongly, New Brighton Tower FC started in the 1800's and went bust around the 1910's.

The Tower Ground supposedly held 120,000 people. It was knocked down for housing and i'm not sure New Brighton FC ever played in it.

Then I ate his Liver.......... with some baked beans and a can of coke.

Some great footage here. Cheers.
As I understand it New Brighton Tower FC was created in the very early 1900's as an alternative attraction to visitors in the winter months. They played at the tower grounds. Money was thrown at the club but it only lasted a few years as gates were low and the team failed to make it to the top flight. New Brighton FC was a totally unconnected club that came into the football league in the early 1920's and lasted at Rake Lane until WW2. After the war they moved to the existing vacant tower grounds but lost their football league status in the early 50's and never returned, sadly losing their home ground, support and sustainability until they disbanded in the early 80's? Not sure when the tower grounds were levelled. About 20 years ago maybe?

Basically Gloucester, that's correct. Although I think the New Brighton teams that survived following demotion from the league were what would now be called phoenix clubs rather than a continuation. They ended up in the West Cheshire in the 70s. The Tower Grounds survived until the late 70s at least. I remember seeing my old man play there once as a nipper. Had a big banked track around the pitch which I rode my bike around!

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Doogie'sGhost
Basically Gloucester, that's correct. Although I think the New Brighton teams that survived following demotion from the league were what would now be called phoenix clubs rather than a continuation. They ended up in the West Cheshire in the 70s. The Tower Grounds survived until the late 70s at least. I remember seeing my old man play there once as a nipper. Had a big banked track around the pitch which I rode my bike around!

the tower ground is where i saw rovers reserves not rake lane.im positive they played their league games there till the demise in the 50s. Derby matches with rovers in the league attracted 15000+ ive read about special ferry and match tickets from woodside .

I learnt a lot so I have just copied the below for you. NB were a historic fact in my time, as a league entity just a piece of history. There again remember running into Accie fans when they were NW Counties never thought we'd be behind them, suppose the clue was they had travelling fans!
Whatever things may have been, pretty sure I would have been a white through birthplace. But you do wonder, not ever having a derby rival I have never had any great feeling against any other team. I preclude those I played against. But as a fan, Blues, reds, Bolton, Chester all just sources of mild amusement at times for me.
However a Wirral derby, grounds full and in the 80's the completely porous Wirral urban scene melts into borders with Wallasey (the real identity I guess) and potential battles for the bridges before matches. Mind boggles how that would have played out in those mad days, very badly I suspect. Anyway read away......................................................

Like Sheffield United, Liverpool, Chelsea and Thames, New Brighton Tower were formed to play at an already-built stadium. The owners of the New Brighton Tower, a seaside attraction built to rival the Blackpool Tower, decided there was a need to provide winter entertainment, and had built a stadium adjacent to the tower. The football club was formed in 1896 to provide the entertainment, and joined the Lancashire League at the start of the 1897–98 season.[1] After finishing as champions in their first season, the club applied for election to the Football League. Although they were initially rejected, the league later decided to expand Division Two by four clubs and New Brighton Tower were accepted.[2]

The club signed a number of new players, including some who had played international football, and was reasonably successful, finishing 5th (out of 18) in its first season, and 4th in their third season. However, with the club poorly supported (averaging gates of around 1,000),[2] the cost of maintaining a professional football club became too high for the Tower's owners, and the club was disbanded in the summer of 1901, and replaced in the League by Doncaster Rovers.

In 1921, a new club was formed, New Brighton, who would also play in the Football League from 1923 until 1951, though initially they played at Sandheys Park until that was destroyed in World War II.

The tower was taken down during World War I, and the rest of the complex destroyed by fire in the late 1960s. The Team's nickname was the Towerites and their home kit in their first season was white shirts and blue shorts. This however changed for the following season to salmon pink shirts with a black trim and white shorts.

The original New Brighton A.F.C. was formed in 1921 out of the ashes of the bankrupt South Liverpool. The club started life in the Lancashire Combination in 1921, assuming South Liverpool's membership, under the chairmanship of local GP Dr. Tom Martlew. They played at Sandheys Park, situated on Rake Lane between Osbourne Avenue and Penkett Road. It is thought that the location of this ground gave rise to the club's nickname, The Rakers, which they kept for the rest of their existence.

After two seasons, the club was elected to the Third Division North of the Football League when the division expanded to 22 clubs. They also played Football League games at Tower Athletic Ground (formerly home to New Brighton Tower) from 1946 to 1951, after Sandheys Park was destroyed by Luftwaffe bombing during World War Two. The Sandheys Park bombsite subsequently was requisitioned for housing.

In Third Division North, the club's history was largely undistinguished. From 1924 to 1928 Rakers managed top ten finishes, with the closest to promotion being a third-place finish in Season 1924/25, five points behind champions Darlington. After 1928, the club failed to finish in the top ten of the league for the rest of their existence.

The club reached the fourth round of the FA Cup on four occasions; firstly in 1925–26, when Notts County beat them 2–0 at Meadow Lane; in the 1927–28 season when they lost to Port Vale, in the 1937–38 season under WJ Sawyer when they lost to Tottenham Hotspur in a replay, and in the 1956–57 season, when as a non-League club, they beat three League clubs before losing to 9–0 away to first division leaders, Burnley.

With Sandheys Park badly damaged during a bombing raid in 1942, after World War II the club moved to the Tower Athletic Ground, the former home of New Brighton Tower. The club remained in the Third Division North until 1951, when they were voted out of the Football League after finishing bottom and replaced by Workington.

In these last years, the Rakers set one final record. On 15 March 1947, manager Neil McBain was forced to play in goal at Hartlepools; becoming the oldest player, at 51 years and 120 days, to feature in a Football League match. Rakers were beaten 3–0 in the game. As of June 2018 this record is still intact.

The club dropped into the Lancashire Combination, before switching to the Cheshire County League in 1965. In 1981 the club finished bottom of the Cheshire County League second division, and were not re-elected. By then they had left the Tower Athletic Ground and were playing in Hoylake at Carr Lane, the club owed money to the Inland Revenue and were forced to leave their ground in Hoylake which had seen much vandalism to its clubhouse.

Despite a ground share with Newton FC from the West Cheshire League they failed to keep their Cheshire County League place, and it was too late to gain admission back into the West Cheshire League in which the Reserve side had played.

However the club were accepted rather late into the South Wirral Premier Division for 1981–1982. This would prove a difficult season for them, losing players and ending up being relegated to the South Wirral First Division for season 1982–1983. The club was refused permission to build a ground in Leasowe Road not far from their former grounds.

In the club's final season (1982–83), it was run by Len Ainscow (Chairman), Gary Burns (Secretary and Press-Secretary) and Brian Oxton (Manager and Treasurer). Oxton resigned the club from the league, but this was quickly reversed by Gary Burns and a side was hastily put together that lost to Rake Social by 11–3, with Geoff Tolley in charge for one game. Oxton returned as Manager, but shortly afterwards New Brighton was heavily beaten by Rake Social and by the end of the season it was clear that the club could no longer function. Despite calls for more Committee/Directors, there was little response and the club was disbanded.

As a side note if you got this far, NB were playing on a park pitch in the end. Les the Chair was a cabbie and if he picked you up the conversation was pretty obvious. Rovers plight around then was perilous to say the least, he drove one of those East German wartburgs or something like that last car to break £1,000 new. Sort of summed up the plight of the even worse off. Circa 1982?

Just to follow on from that, there was a further reincarnation of New Brighton FC in the mid-1990s, who played in the West Cheshire League for 15 seasons or so. They played at Harrison Park. Steve Mungall played for them!

Just a footnote.we engaged a manager from nb walter galbraith who was a disaster relegating us in his ist year 1961

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Loyden1

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Doogie'sGhost
Basically Gloucester, that's correct. Although I think the New Brighton teams that survived following demotion from the league were what would now be called phoenix clubs rather than a continuation. They ended up in the West Cheshire in the 70s. The Tower Grounds survived until the late 70s at least. I remember seeing my old man play there once as a nipper. Had a big banked track around the pitch which I rode my bike around!

the tower ground is where i saw rovers reserves not rake lane.im positive they played their league games there till the demise in the 50s. Derby matches with rovers in the league attracted 15000+ ive read about special ferry and match tickets from woodside .

That would be correct I'm sure. They definitely used the Tower Grounds post WW2 until the ground was developed for housing.

The Hoylake ground they used was, I'm pretty sure, the old Ellerman Lines ground in Carr Lane rather than the old Hoylake FC ground. That became a nightclub until it was burned down in 'mysterious' circumstances.

I made-out with the blonde broad who worked at the Bright Spot ice-cream parlour (circa 1992) on the Tower Grounds. I can't remember the details of the evening, but we ended up on the Tower Grounds around midnight. She was considerably older than me, possibly 10 years older.

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I also made-out with the blonde barmaid who worked at Lacy's on Victoria Road (circa 1991) Alas, not on the Tower Grounds but in my Nana's box room.

And the broad with massive bangers (Michelle) who worked at the Granada chippy on Victoria Road. We cut-through the Tower Grounds to get down onto the prom and then up to her flat near Vale Park. She was a good 4-5 years older than me. She actually made me breakfast (bacon and eggs) in the morning.

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E L V I S
I also made-out with the blonde barmaid who worked at Lacy's on Victoria Road (circa 1991) Alas, not on the Tower Grounds but in my Nana's box room.
And the broad with massive bangers (Michelle) who worked at the Granada chippy on Victoria Road. We cut-through the Tower Grounds to get down onto the prom and then up to her flat near Vale Park. She was a good 4-5 years older than me. She actually made me breakfast (bacon and eggs) in the morning.

Nah, I’m not into that kind of immoral thing…….I’m a vegetarian.
Now, if she’d have been a Quorn sausage kind of girl…
Vale Park use to host a cracking Rhythm ‘n’ Blues (well, Rhythm ‘n’ Booze!!) festival in the days before we had kids when I enjoyed my wife’s company.

On the subject of any proposed new ground, the most important factor and the big question on everybody’s lips “Will they make a LEGO version of it to sell in its grandiose club shop?”; it could be located next to the Tranmere duvets (for those who’re into that sort of thing). I’d also suggest they sell Tranmere mints (plagiarised from the Everton…“spit”…version); with it being Tranmere, I’ve no doubt they’d be humbugs though.

🎡🎢. ."theres a bird in new brighton chippy thinks she @#$%& elvis "good song that

I'm going to Leyton Orient on the 18th. I'll be playing low-limit 1-2 nlh Friday and Saturday night. There's probably no money in Liverpool/Manchester

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Stay where we are. Build new stadium on car park and the ground area as car park.

The current market site is not big enough for a stadium but The area over the road currently occupied by the Europa Pools and Vue cinema and the car park behind Conway Park station certainly is. Both the pool and cinema would have to come down, as maybe would the Crown Pub and the building next to it but the station being mainly underground could easily be incorporated into one of the stands. A stadium there would have great transport links and would help regenerate the town centre.

Dont think chris in the crown would be happy losing his pub.but its listed building anyway

It was suggested before, the old Gas Board site and offices behind central station.

The problem would be its classed as a brown field site and would need some remediation before construction could commence.

Again good transport links.

With the current onus on Birkenhead Town Centre redevelopment, surely a suitable site could be found?

The Council may be looking to offload the Boroughs Golf clubs soon in order to raise some money.
Brackenwood would perhaps be an ideal site for a new Rovers Gound, ?

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Prenton oldpup
The Council may be looking to offload the Boroughs Golf clubs soon in order to raise some money.
Brackenwood would perhaps be an ideal site for a new Rovers Gound, ?

I doubt it. Greenbelt land and in the worst case scenario more likely that it would be sold off as a going concern.

What’s interesting about the debate is that there is a consensus, as far as I can tell, for a move in to Birkenhead rather than an out of town location.

A riverside site opposite Bramley Moore Dock would gain a lot of attention and put the club on more people's radar as the club from the other side of the Mersey. Whenever Everton were on the telly or media they would pan across the river to show the 'other' ground as opposed to us being more of an 'Accrington - who/where/what are they club. Placing the ground somewhere unique and putting a bit of effort into it's design would give the club more kudos and maybe more support than just building another out of town MFI warehouse as per Colchester/Walsall/Bolton/Yeovil etc

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Gargy
A riverside site opposite Bramley Moore Dock would gain a lot of attention and put the club on more people's radar as the club from the other side of the Mersey. Whenever Everton were on the telly or media they would pan across the river to show the 'other' ground as opposed to us being more of an 'Accrington - who/where/what are they club. Placing the ground somewhere unique and putting a bit of effort into it's design would give the club more kudos and maybe more support than just building another out of town MFI warehouse as per Colchester/Walsall/Bolton/Yeovil etc

This.
Grounds in Britain with any sort of presence you can count on one hand. Newcastle looks down over City. Middlesbrough is riverside but the Tees is narrow there. Fulham appears on the boat race
The Mersey provides the sort of broad water Sydney Opera House enjoys.
As you stated dilapidated town centre grounds have been replaced by warehouses out of the way
You need to make the best of what you have, Birko generally offers little.............. but a riverside practically in the town centre

As I grew up quite close to Molyneux road, and lived around the area during the seventies and eighties.
My first experience was in 1959, when my brother's took me to the Tower ground, which the fair and grounds were booming at the time.
I remember the Rakers playing in red and white which was a duplicate of the Arsenal style. No idea who they were playing.
I remember the tea bar by the dressing room., Which was about a hundred yards from the pitch becos of the cycle track bank. This became part of the bangers track in the early eighties.
New Brighton FC. Were still playing until the 1972 season. When due to costs, had to move.
I actually played on the massive pitch at the end of that season for Poulton Athletic becos then, the Wallasey youth and senior finals were played there. We lost 1-0. We were the last cup final played on that football pitch.
There was much disagreement about how the Rakers nickname came about. The history is such. New Brighton Tower FC, were known as the wreckers, due to the locals in the 17th century, deliberately wrecking ships coming into the Mersey, and robbing the cargo. New Brighton FC moved to the Tower Ground after the war. And becos, the club playing off Rake Lane, the two naturally became the one nickname. Or was it the accent?
The Rakers social club was around for about three or four years after the football finished. And there was a disco Monday night's , there was some decent acts on there around that time, local comedians, local acts that did the club's then. One I particularly remember was the Barron Knights. Is that right?
And my first job, was to put together the printing of Rakers programme. Basic, two sheets of A4, folded and stapled.

The last time I saw a team with the New Brighton named was about fifteen years ago at shaftes on a Saturday afternoon. And it was worse than a Sunday div four game!

A mate of mine looked after the pitch at Newtown.

I don't know why but I found a snippet from the rich dated Match 2015! Where the new owners established that there was no reason to move.
However, as they found out rather rapidly that the option to move was something that had to be put back on the agenda.
And then, after getting knowledge about the cost of moving and the removal of the asbestos, the roof and insulation around the infrastructure. The board had to reassess the situation.
Since the turn of the century, the club had consistently talked about the viability of the present location of the ground to somewhere a purpose built stadia, with a functional non matchday cash flow.
Remember Wirral wolves? Cammel Lairds, Behind Central station, Bidston, New Brighton, The docks! And ongoing talks with Peel holdings on Wirral Waters. And now Birkenhead market????

Might as well, buy shaftes and build there!
Nicola should be able to put that together!!!!!

And the longer we don't move, becos of the viability of maintaining the ground, the more it will cost in real terms!

Our ground is ok, but unsuitable for growth!

Pretty sure Shafts has covenants on it and has always been used for purpose. Plenty of post-industrial sites by the river where an almost uniquely iconic ground could be built.

It was tongue in cheek mate, Nicola is on the committee there.

And you are correct about the covenant.