Rugby Union Game Schism on the way - Again?

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2025:04:18:08:33:39 by Kimbo.

I'll not comment too much on the fact that Alistair might have been well-served by seeking the services of a professional proofreader before going so public!
However, that aside, I couldn't agree more with his sentiments - and no doubt with those of the remainder of the Tier Two (etc.) supremos.
Some of the recent unpalatable spoutings of Beaumont on behalf of Sweeney, cast a very different light on things, viz:

- There has been a free and frank exchange of views...
- Contrary to reports... the game's finances are in robust shape...
- The overwhelming view from the roadshows is that specific criticisms around RFU finances and Bill's remuneration were not the priority issue.
And
- To those of you with a vote: please use it wisely.


I couldn't agree more with the last one, but certainly not in the way he would hope. The rest, I see as utter nonsense.

Oh so true. I appears that they have dug themselves into a hole, with no redeeming circumstances, so all that needs being done is to fill in that hole.

Meanwhile, in a bigger conversion than happened on the road to Damascus........

[www.planetrugby.com]

It's another miracle.

Sorry, I can't agree with that. Bill Sweeney is indicative of all that is wrong with the RFU. He's so far out of touch with the game beyond his own international gin and ticket cabinet, it's untrue. They can't even sort the premiership out in terms of the sides in it.

It's too simple to do - 14 sides in the prem, 14 in the Champ and in each league below that to Level 6 and no leagues below that level. Promote the top 4 championship sides, give them equal funding as the other 10 and have two up two down in the leagues. At least 2 Championship sides will survive the first season and grow into the level.

Too simple? Or just wishful thinking?

Quote:

Egg Timer
Sorry, I can't agree with that. Bill Sweeney is indicative of all that is wrong with the RFU. He's so far out of touch with the game beyond his own international gin and ticket cabinet, it's untrue. They can't even sort the premiership out in terms of the sides in it.
It's too simple to do - 14 sides in the prem, 14 in the Champ and in each league below that to Level 6 and no leagues below that level. Promote the top 4 championship sides, give them equal funding as the other 10 and have two up two down in the leagues. At least 2 Championship sides will survive the first season and grow into the level.

Too simple? Or just wishful thinking?

Certainly not the former.
Definitely the latter.

Quote:

Paul Ingleston
Meanwhile, in a bigger conversion than happened on the road to Damascus........
[www.planetrugby.com]

It's another miracle.

Laughable.

Quote:

Egg Timer
Sorry, I can't agree with that. Bill Sweeney is indicative of all that is wrong with the RFU. He's so far out of touch with the game beyond his own international gin and ticket cabinet, it's untrue. They can't even sort the premiership out in terms of the sides in it.
It's too simple to do - 14 sides in the prem, 14 in the Champ and in each league below that to Level 6 and no leagues below that level. Promote the top 4 championship sides, give them equal funding as the other 10 and have two up two down in the leagues. At least 2 Championship sides will survive the first season and grow into the level.

Too simple? Or just wishful thinking?

Never, ever, apply for a role in the RFU, that's far too innovative and forward thinking! They always prefer complicated processes as it makes them feel superior and in control. Btw, surely the next hare-brained scheme has to be return of ' brands' and ' franchises?'. That's been quiet for far too long!

Quote:

Paul Ingleston

Quote:

Egg Timer
Sorry, I can't agree with that. Bill Sweeney is indicative of all that is wrong with the RFU. He's so far out of touch with the game beyond his own international gin and ticket cabinet, it's untrue. They can't even sort the premiership out in terms of the sides in it.
It's too simple to do - 14 sides in the prem, 14 in the Champ and in each league below that to Level 6 and no leagues below that level. Promote the top 4 championship sides, give them equal funding as the other 10 and have two up two down in the leagues. At least 2 Championship sides will survive the first season and grow into the level.

Too simple? Or just wishful thinking?

Never, ever, apply for a role in the RFU, that's far too innovative and forward thinking! They always prefer complicated processes as it makes them feel superior and in control. Btw, surely the next hare-brained scheme has to be return of ' brands' and ' franchises?'. That's been quiet for far too long!

That will depend on how much Sweeney and his mates will be able to make out of it.

Turkeys never vote for Xmas.
RFU simply allow the premiership to "gobble" up the cash to overpay players and run up further debt.
The rest the clubs can simply starve without even chicken feed.
Incompetent doesn't begin to accurately describe the vested interests.

And the results are:

[www.bbc.co.uk]

Utter testicles

What was promised behind closed doors???
I wonder how long it'll be before those who supported Sweeney this time
will start moaning about being let down etc.

It’s the hope that kills you

More lodge members turned up than usual....

Quote:

Ken I L Worth
More lodge members turned up than usual....

Everyone had the opportunity to vote remotely.

It appears the "groundswell of grassroots feeling" was just a small minority of clubs banging their drums very loudly.

BB

Quote:

Brown Bottle

Quote:

Ken I L Worth
More lodge members turned up than usual....

Everyone had the opportunity to vote remotely.

It appears the "groundswell of grassroots feeling" was just a small minority of clubs banging their drums very loudly.

I am not sure that 1/3 voting against Sweeney could be regarded as "a small minority", but I take your point

Complete Joke as usual like trying to vote the Prime minister out then surprise surprise they all come out the woodwork and save the monster from his deserved fate. The losers as usual the Rugby teams who deserve much better.

Possible conversation in the Twickenham management suite:
How are we going to fund the executive bonuses for next year?
Got it -let's make further cuts to the Championship funding!
Obviously only kidding!!!

Talk about hollowing out the Rugby ambitions of the professional game by favouring the premiership by "ring fencing" and money . Flattering the amateur side with platitudes which leaves the middle (us and other ambitious teams) struggling to keep going giving a ladder for promotion and advancement to those outside the chosen few I don't think it could be worse

Quote from rfu statement after thursdays meeting......We must do this with the understanding that we are all working together toward the betterment of the game we love, FREE FROM THE INFLUENCE OF ANY ONE MINORITY OR GROUP...........so the premiership teams will have no say or influence on decisions ,protocols or payments

I believe that the attendance at Chinnor on Saturday was just over 2,100.
According to the match report on the Newcastle Falcons website, the attendance for their recent home "Premiership Derby Weekend" match against Sale Sharks was 5,402, and Ealing aren't allowed to challenge them for their place in the Premiership!

Quote:

JAB1957
I believe that the attendance at Chinnor on Saturday was just over 2,100.
According to the match report on the Newcastle Falcons website, the attendance for their recent home "Premiership Derby Weekend" match against Sale Sharks was 5,402, and Ealing aren't allowed to challenge them for their place in the Premiership!

Ealing practice the worst kind of business model, a multi millionaire pouring in millions to pay huge salaries at championship level.
The income generated by the club is peanuts compared to it's expenditure, buying status well beyond their true place in the ladder.

Quote:

covkid1953

Quote:

JAB1957
I believe that the attendance at Chinnor on Saturday was just over 2,100.
According to the match report on the Newcastle Falcons website, the attendance for their recent home "Premiership Derby Weekend" match against Sale Sharks was 5,402, and Ealing aren't allowed to challenge them for their place in the Premiership!

Ealing practice the worst kind of business model, a multi millionaire pouring in millions to pay huge salaries at championship level.
The income generated by the club is peanuts compared to it's expenditure, buying status well beyond their true place in the ladder.

That business model is ideally suited to the current Premiership!

We may not like their model, but it is no different to the way many of the Premiership clubs have achieved/maintained their Premiership status.
I recall that Newcastle's first season in the Premiership, under a benevolent ownership, was in 1997/98 and twenty five years later they have an attendance of only 5,402 for their (most) local derby, yet it is almost impossible to challenge their position.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2025:04:01:12:39:32 by JAB1957.

We should be wishing Ealing well.
Personally I'd love to see them promoted, if only to see the back of them.

There is currently an article on the BBC website with the title "Uncertainty over £400m of Covid loans yet to be paid back." It's worth a read as it includes some interesting points. I've picked out one or two which I think are of interest.

Between 2020 and 2022, the DCMS gave £124m to Premiership rugby union clubs including London Irish, Wasps and Worcester - with the DCMS saying it does not expect to recover up to £29m of the £41m it lent to them.

Also, with both Newcastle and Exeter both recently seeking investment, they admitted being increasingly pessimistic over the financial stability of the club game. The last set of accounts filed by all Premiership clubs in 2022-23 showed that they collectively lost £30.5m and have net debts of more than £300m, and fear that the finances of elite clubs are unsustainable.

It has appointed consultants and engaged with the RFU, the PRL and CVC Capital Partners on the future of rugby union.

Which absolutely backs the argument for why the Championship clubs are actually being very sensible in their pragmatism. Look at any of the premiership discussion boards (and some comments by supporters of certain phoenix brands) and you read people spouting that Championship clubs that don’t apply for promotion lack ambition. I would argue that they are taking a sensible (very) long game approach and view sustainability as far more important than accepting the risks that accompany promotion to a hugely unstable top division.
Out of interest, if a championship club can decline promotion, does anyone know whether the rules permit cubs to request voluntary relegation from in order to re-set their business model and protect their assets? Surely that should be a sensible option at any level of the game, in preference to seeing clubs completely fold. I suppose that it would have to come with certain caveats to prevent yo-yoing and to ensure other clubs were not negatively impacted.

The premiership needs to be dismantled along with the championship.
There should be a one year sabbatical where clubs play friendlies until their books, business models, income and expenditure, debts etc are fully documented.
At the same time, we need the same thing from the RFU.
Just sticking Wuss, with debts written down but not out, is not going to fix anything.
English rugby is bankrupt, with evidence of up to a combined debt of £400m reported.
Until we know where we are, Rugby will continue to career headlong into the buffers.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2025:04:04:17:36:43 by covkid1953.