Shelford and Evans paint different pictures

By kwin
December 2 2002

After the game on Saturday Saracens coach Buck Shelford was in a plaintive mood. "I thought we actually lost the game. The players are disappointed...they believe they actually lost the game. Stupid mistakes really cost us...with an ounce of luck we could have stole it

The errors were terrible both sides - Mark just had more points on the board at the end of the day.  At least we're not coming away with no points, like we do from most away games. I'm pretty pleased to get two points out of it"

He explained what the problem is "We've guys in this squad, and likewise around the country and in other professional teams and that simply won't make S12 squads in New Zealand. That's the vast difference between the two leagues - a lot of players that are in these clubs simply would not make S12. The standard of skills between the top players and the bottom players is quite vast - and it's a game of skills, if you don't have the skills at this level you'll actually suffer"

The fault he believes is in the system "You've got the players here [England] but your league is so too big Your top 50 players are good enough, but you put you top 50 players back out to 12 clubs it's not many per club is it?  But that's just the way it is"

Warming to his theme, he continued the hatchet job  "In the last three months we've fitness tested the guys quite regularly now...and most of the players in the Saracens squad are way off S12 stats for VO2 levels and strength levels and speed. that's a real good indicator as where they lie compared to S12" 

He hadn't finished  "Mind, you've got to have that want and desire too don't you?..  if you want to be the best you have to train harder...and a lot of professional  players - the harder you train them the more they moan, but if you want to the be the best you have to put in the hours that a lot of other players don't do....if you want to be a pro you have to earn it..... About 9 out 30 players are at the level of fitness I'd like... but to try and change people's habits here is hard -  it's been ingrained in to them in the last 10 years or s... If all our players took somebody in the world and said 'I want to be like him' and took the best person in the world in his position and looked at his regime - you'd probably find they were 30 hours a week short of what he does"

Next up , Mark Evans was asked to describe the highlights of the game...

"We didn't play very well did we? For the first 25 minutes we didn't have any ball, our kicking game was pants But  as soon as we got the ball off the table and started to get a bit of possession we played a bit of football and got ahead.  I felt at half time we were going to win comfortably"

"Then we were 13 points up and we were coasting, frankly...but at 13 points up in the modern game you haven't won it. Although we had a man in the sin bin we'd weathered the storm, and we did a fantastic 7 man scrummage on our own line - great credit to Bruce Starr and Laurent Gomez who was injured, but had had to go back on (we're starting to scrummage a now which is very pleasing - we've got three scrummagers now in Starr and Gomez and Leonard)

So... we held our own ball, and got out of it quite well, and got to the half way line and then we got a penalty. [The ref signalled advantage to us] but we didn't throw the ball  to floor.   And then we got another penalty and again didn't throw it  to the floor. I was furious.  Keep going like that and sooner or later the Ref's going to say 'advantage over' .... in my book there IS no advantage other than kicking for goal or kicking for the corner....because funnily enough the last time I looked driving mauls score five, same as any other try, so I wasn't a happy bunny.  I got frustrated then and let them know.

I felt it should have been a 5-0 game.  I'm a bit disappointed in 4-2 which was the end  - it's a bit dissatisfying actually...we should have killed it but we didn't. It was the quietest winning dressing room I've been in for while I'd say.... It was aesthetically dissatisfying.....  But I'm happier than I was last week - four points happier in fact..

He explained why Vos went off: "I took him off because he'd had a bad shoulder all week.   We had to take someone off  [because of the sin-bin] and the physio said 'he's struggling, I  said 'he's a South African he'll be fine' He's not playing next week, because he's not eligible leave him on!...but off he went"

Mark talked about his philosophy on training  "We  hardly trained at all  this week - I'm a bit of a less is more man actually. And we were in bits -  virtually everyone was carrying injuries".   He went on:  "But I'm pleased with all of my squad in terms of fitness - all of them.  They're in good shape.  I mean you can always get better do more,  but the only sensible question you can attempt to answer  is: do you feel your players are preparing themselves well physically, mentally and technically in the time that is  available and my answer is 'yes all of them'.

He was asked about Shelford's comparisons between ZP and S12:  'He's never actually coached S12 has he? so it's an interesting comparison... Well I suppose he's watched it, well I've watched it too and its a completely different type of rugby.

"Let's make a comparison shall we?  You list all the S12 people who've been brilliant  in S12 and come over here and been absolute garbage. I could make a list probably equally as long of all the people who've been good in S12 and come over here and been  good. So I would suggest that there are some very good players on both sides of the world.  I don't buy this 'we're all brilliant and they're not rubbish, I mean the last time I looked the S12 had 3 or 4 South African sides in it....

"I get fed up, with people coming into our league and saying it's not as good as theirs.  It's just different  This is a much more physically gruelling type of rugby and refereed entirely differently"

Mark was asked whether the International players found it hard to get up for games at the Stoop after playing in front of a crowd ten times the size over the road, but he dismissed the idea  "The very competitive are motivated internally, and they  compete whether it's at tiddlywinks or anything else - the exception I suppose would be a S12 ruck!.  No, Will had a good game, he defended extremely well,  hw was positioned well - and a terrific kick for  the first  try..

And Jason? "I think Leonard's in the form of his life to be honest - he's playing really really well, played both sides again today - an hour on the loose head, 10 minutes in the bin, 25 minutes on the tight head - the man's versatile"

He turned to next week's game -  "Looking forward to it. Different week,  different competition   It's a great tie - they've got some quality acts.. I really hope Galthie plays, I always like watching him, and who knows,  we might have few boys back ourselves"

He was asked for his prediction - "Well, we might play like we did against Caerphilly at home in which case we'll get shipped by 60 ... or we might put on a performance like we did against Newcastle, and then we'll win by 20"