Northampton Saints v Bath Rugby - Teams Up

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:12:09:09:01:44 by Saint Ted.

Bath have lost 8 from 8 and have a huge injury list. This is an injured side they are not able to field:

Beno Obano, Tom Doughty, Juan Schoeman
Will Spencer, Ethan Staddon
Miles Reid, Taulupe Faletau, Jaco Coetzee

Cameron Redpath, Orlando Bailey
Max Clark, Jonathan Joseph
Joe Cokanasiga, Ruaridh McConnochie, Anthony Watson

So just the type of game we should win but are prone to switching off and messing up. We need to turn up for this game.

They will be better structured with Spencer back but their defence is suspect and they struggle to score tries. So no excuses.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:12:03:12:40:37 by Saint Maul.

Bath still have a very useful back 5 in the pack and top quality half backs, so take nothing for granted!!

Biggar v "Chipolata" will be interesting......

Hopefully Courtney isn't injured but has just been given the week off

I like the look of our side and on form, on paper, this is a game we should win and win well.

Which is what I hope to see. Yet somehow it has banana skin written all over it, doesn’t it?

It happens all too often with the Saints unfortunately

Even though Bath have players missing, you do wonder why that side is struggling.

Spenser / Cipriani will need watching,

Is AW looking to break his run of continuous starting selections,
Does he have a compromising photo of Darbon in his walet

A win without Courts and Proctor will be a job well done.

Which of that Bath team would you select above the Saints team?

The only one I might swap is Waller for Boyce because I rate Will Stuart and Boyce may yield fewer scrum penalties.

Quote:

Saintly Pursuit
Hopefully Courtney isn't injured but has just been given the week off

Isn’t it England related and number of minutes played so has to take a rest (hopefully)

Quote:

Santiago
Which of that Bath team would you select above the Saints team?
The only one I might swap is Waller for Boyce because I rate Will Stuart and Boyce may yield fewer scrum penalties.

Players tend to look better in successful sides. How many of our players would stand out playing in the current Bath side or playing for Worcester?

Possibly 3 Bath players, given they are recently selected internationals:

Stuart for Painter
Ewels for Moon
Underhill for Ludlum

The bookies odds before the teams were announced had Saints at 6/19 for the win, Bath 18/5 with a 9 point spread.

After the team announcements, 1/4 for Saints and 4/1 for Bath; points spread out to 11.

Quote:

Saint Maul

Quote:

Santiago
Which of that Bath team would you select above the Saints team?
The only one I might swap is Waller for Boyce because I rate Will Stuart and Boyce may yield fewer scrum penalties.

Players tend to look better in successful sides. How many of our players would stand out playing in the current Bath side or playing for Worcester?

Possibly 3 Bath players, given they are recently selected internationals

Stuart for Painter
Ewels for Moon
Underhill for Ludlum

I’d not swap any of those. Stuart and Ewels are really not international material and I’d be surprised if Ewels features once Launchbury and Kruis are back assuming K is returning.

Underhill has also been holding his England shirt on the back of past deeds and Luds is in a rich vein of form atm

Quote:

Saintly Pursuit
Hopefully Courtney isn't injured but has just been given the week off

Down to Covid at the school his kids are at I think.

Bath took Chiefs all the way last time out and should have won, and probably would have if the ref had paid any attention to the offside line.

I would not take them for granted, a hurting side that will have confidence given that they should have beaten Chiefs. I would feel better with Proctor in the team.

Agreed, I thought they played well against Exeter and have caused us problems over the last few seasons. Spencer/Cipriani will need close attention. They are better than the table suggests. I've got a bad feeling about this game - I hope I'm wrong!

Courts put in three massive shifts in the AI’s so he might be having a rest and being saved for next weeks European

I think like some this should be a game we win on paper but Bath are desperate for a win and we are prone to a slip up

An inexperienced Bath midfield that has never played together needs to be targeted and tested in different ways.

Danny (I don't like to tackle) Cipriani plus two young novices in the centre with Butt on his debut and a green (if promising) Ojomoh. Butt is a big unit but that also provides opportunities to exploit like our footwork v a bigger man and dink kicks when Spencer isn't in position to act as a rover.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:12:04:08:16:00 by Saint Maul.

It's a big game for Dave Ribbans. He was desperately unlucky not to have played for England on last season's form but for his ban.

He hasn't been in the same form this season. He is up against two rivals Eddie Jones has favoured in Ewels and McNally. So I'm hoping for a statement performance against his rivals. Good luck Dave.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:12:04:08:43:35 by Saint Maul.

Just read Will Greenwood's article about Saints from the Telegraph. Very nice article about the team, but for some bizarre reason makes me nervous! Without any real dominant put 'em away type wins (excluding Worcs, but everyone was doing that to them at the time), I just want to see Saints gain the edge early and simply outplay Bath for the full 80, without taking their usual mental naps from time to time.

Paper just arrived, these articles usually come just before an under par performance ! Just a solid professional performance please this afternoon.


Possession and Territory usually wins.

Wizard more importantly more points than them usually does it :-)

I agree with the thoughts on Dave Ribbans - it's what I'd been thinking.
In a match on the box a few weeks ago Ojomo was being bigged up by the commentators, but whilst skillful he seemed to lack gas after making a break or chasing a loose ball. It may have been a bad day for him but I'll be watching to see if he is short of pace.

Hi Saints fans, how are you all doing today ? I am on the express train from London Euston to Northampton. Arriving shortly! As it’s a Saturday I’m going to indulge in a beer before the game. Don’t tell the bloody wife she’s been at me all week and I don’t need the extra hassle. Where are the best spots in town for a pre match tipple? Rgds Mike

Roko - suggest you head for the ground. Good pup opposite and ‘Village’ atmosphere in ground usually excellent. Real ale in the Village also good.

Roko beware of train delays on the way back from Northampton. I have to get back to Lancashire and am expecting to miss my connection up norf from Milton Keynes

Thanks Hodders. I’m at sevens now playing pool. If you see us feel free to buy us a round!

Saints looking on top and cruising according to Lennie
Leading 14 - 0

Which promptly leads to saints giving away a sloppy try

Karl Dickson penalising Saints on a regular basis

HT - 28-12 to Saints, try bonus point.

Lenny's view - some quality tries but otherwise Saints have been 'awful'. If that is true then Bath must be woeful.

Bath came back to snatch it last season so fingers crossed Saints don't switch off and let them back in.

Sounds like a poor game truncated by some quality in terms of tries. Need to stamp on the throat so to speak and kill this game off quickly

40-19 after 67 minutes.

Full time 40-19

So we are definitely top 4 come Xmas.

Bath slowing the game down at every opportunity and not even attempting to olay any rugby. Hard to play a team doing that, a wins a win. Great to see us unearthing some gems from lower leagues, Matevesi and Wilkins.

I thought it was bitty game, mostly because Dickson let Bath have committee meetings before every scrum or line out (I know he spoke to them once or twice but that was the pattern throughout)

I do like Augustus but was still surprised to see him throw in while Matavesi was in the bin. Hidden talents- maybe we could convert him to hooker*

Overall, we avoided the banana skin I feared this game might be, got the 5 points and consolidated our Top 4 position. So I’m happy enough with that.

Bath really can’t catch a break though, can they? Because they just aren’t as bad as their results suggest IMO.

Thought Bath were incredibly negative at the death, with possession but kicking the ball out to end the game. One more try for them and they'd have got a bonus point from the game, one more try against (they weren't far from their own line) wouldn't really have meant anything. Seems we're not the only team that on occasion makes some odd decisions.

We have a penalty away with Dan moaning at ref about Baths tactics. I have no issue with the penalty and good to see things like that being called out and given

BUT nothing was done all game about Baths tactics , a quick free kick to saints for it and threat of a penalty would soon have changed behaviours and made for a better game.

But a good win. 5 points.

Quote:

Dave Jackson
We have a penalty away with Dan moaning at ref about Baths tactics. I have no issue with the penalty and good to see things like that being called out and given
BUT nothing was done all game about Baths tactics , a quick free kick to saints for it and threat of a penalty would soon have changed behaviours and made for a better game.

But a good win. 5 points.

+1

This is an entertainment product and as such the referees have an important part to play how the game is played. I have no issue with Bath’s tactics BUT referees cannot allow teams to slow things down to a snails pace. South Africa do it at international level and goes on too much at club level too. Easily resolved as you suggested Dave. There was a lot of backchat in the Exeter v Sarries game as well which similarly could be easily dealt with. Warnings, free kicks, penalties, 10 yards March back and ultimately yellow cards. They have enough to stop this fairly quickly and yet routinely fail to do anything at all

Quote:

SaintsAsh
Bath slowing the game down at every opportunity and not even attempting to olay any rugby. Hard to play a team doing that, a wins a win. Great to see us unearthing some gems from lower leagues, Matevesi and Wilkins.

Don't normally begrudge losing visitors a TBP or LBP, but glad Bath got nowt out of it. Killed any flow in the game and wasted time deliberately at every opportunity. Saints not wise enough to it & Dickson who I generally like as a ref not bothered enough IMO.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021:12:04:18:22:45 by MarchingIn.

Bath might have been more interested if there was still the threat of
relegation this season.

Very good point cparksaint

Quote:

MarchingIn

Quote:

SaintsAsh
Bath slowing the game down at every opportunity and not even attempting to olay any rugby. Hard to play a team doing that, a wins a win. Great to see us unearthing some gems from lower leagues, Matevesi and Wilkins.

Don't normally begrudge losing visitors a TBP or LBP, but glad Bath got nowt out of it. Killed any flow in the game and wasted time deliberately at every opportunity. Saints not wise enough to it & Dickson who I generally like as a ref not bothered enough IMO.

.
Not quite sure what the Saints can do in those circumstances, if they are getting no help from the ref, Bath could carry on unchallenged which sounds like exactly what happened. Saints get frustrated force the pace and errors set in

Don’t really comment of ref’s performance
Don’t see the point, particularly if we lose

But today I thought KD was instrumental in creating a poor flowing game and had the power to expedite Bath
he didn’t play his part and contributed to the general feeling of malaise
The ground was quite and supporters started going home early in the last quarter

The sport relies on paying customers not officials full of their own importance

The good:

Some fantastic tries today and performances. In particular Alex Mitchell had a phenomenal game, the pace of the ball, the quality of his passing and his acceleration around the breakdown was instrumental in most of saints tries. He does make mistakes but we should feel extremely lucky to have him playing for us.

The backs looked really good at times across all 7, showing fantastic hands, decision making and pace.

Finally, Ludlum was fantastic again, playing with incredible workrate, commitment and having so many influential turnovers at the breakdown. For me he outplayed Underhill.

The bad:

Too soft in defence. Given the players Bath had out and then add Cipriani and Spencer getting injured and we really shouldn't have conceded any tries. At times the workrate and physicality was really good but at others we fell far too easily off tackles, gave away silly penalties when we weren't really under that much pressure and really struggled to defend their driving maul and carrying close to the line. Scrum did improve a lot but I think a lot of our props, particularly Waller, just aren't consistent enough to be starting in the premiership.

Overall, some fantastic rugby but unless we front up better, particularly in front five more consistently we'll struggle against the best teams.

Saintfanh, I completely agree, the backs looked fantastic in attack at times. Dingwall really stood out for me, he’s quietly become one of our best, and it seems most important, players. Worth noting that Boyd took him off at the same time as Ribbans and Biggar, highlighting, I think, just how important he is to this team. It also looked like he was giving Biggar a bit of an earful for that reversed penalty, which was good to see.

I also thought Ludlum was outstanding and outplayed Underhill, who didn’t have a bad game himself. The whole back row went pretty well.

If we could cut out our indiscipline, we’d be unplayable at times. I did feel for Bath, coming in on the back of such a long run of losses, then to lose your half backs so early.

Please could someone describe what happened to Spencer, Cipriani and Mike Williams? We really couldn't afford yet more injuries. The cupboard is bare. Congratulations on your win and your form so far this season, but I'm afraid that you won't have learnt much today playing against a mix and match shambles of a team.

I’m glad we avoided the pitfall that I thought this game might pose. We have struggled with Baths lack of tempo and killing of the game in the past but they didn’t have the quality today to hurt us.
I felt the atmosphere at the gardens was pretty flat today which was a bit of a shame.

Bath were desperately unlucky to lose Cips and Spencer to a HiA and injury in the first half with the afore mentioned in experienced back line.

In a results business it’s 10 points from 2 games. However, if we were looking at prep for Racing 92 I don’t think either of the last games will have hardened us for that battle.

Some great incisive moves for tries

Annoyingly high error count from knock ons etc otherwise could have been a hatful

Frustrating slow pace of Bath, but you could see the pace Saints trying to put on game. Mitchell really suits our style with 3s rucks (are you watching Ben Youngs!!)

Ludlam’s work rate immense - he must have a huge pair of lungs. Phenomenal ability to just keep going.

Quote:

cparksaint
Bath might have been more interested if there was still the threat of
relegation this season.

A very nice Bath fan sat next to me with his grandson. He was none too kind about Bath's owner and referred to Hooper as a Bosses Yes Man . He too said that most Bath fans are so glad that there is no demotion.

Highlights are on Premiership website. Some nice tries

Quote:

Walks11
Not quite sure what the Saints can do in those circumstances, if they are getting no help from the ref, Bath could carry on unchallenged which sounds like exactly what happened. Saints get frustrated force the pace and errors set in

Keep the ball on the field and in play. Speed up your own formation of the line and scrum. Direct some 'banter' at Bath about it instead of whining at the ref. Etc...

It was "job done" but a turgid game that the crowd were bored of by the second half. Never heard the Gardens so quiet for a 5 point winning home Prem game. I do blame Dickson more than Saints.

Looks like some nice tries were scored and 10pts from 2games is a great return, no matter who you are playing. Hopefully it gives us some momentum and confidence moving forward.

Many people saying the atmosphere was flat, i've found the Gardens quite flat each time i visited since the Barwell stand was built. Perhaps the combo of Dickson reffing and a naturally quieter Gardens was a lethal combo. I think he's a really low-grade referee actually.

Just watched the highlights, and noticed Biggar commiserating with Mike Williams after Williams was yellowed for the hit on Biggar. Bit of class there.

_____________________________________________

The lowest depth to which people can sink before God is defined by the word 'journalist'.

Soren Kierkegaard

Quote:

Deesaint
Don’t really comment of ref’s performance
Don’t see the point, particularly if we lose

But today I thought KD was instrumental in creating a poor flowing game and had the power to expedite Bath
he didn’t play his part and contributed to the general feeling of malaise
The ground was quite and supporters started going home early in the last quarter

The sport relies on paying customers not officials full of their own importance

They started going home in the 3rd quarter as it was gone 16:45 and all we were getting was time wasting and no flow of the game.

I think we should be stressing the positives (clinical and classy finishing) as Bath were on damage limitation and up to a point succeeded. Another aspect was the conditions - once out of the stadium you realised how cold and blustery it was and this combined with the sloppy refereeing was not conducive to the game we wanted to play.

I don’t think it was flat, in fact there were some great rounds of singing and there was quite an atmosphere for considerable periods. Yes the slow handclap and booing started with the Bath pre-set-piece committee meetings and it got really cold towards the end too.
I too spent over an hour getting out of the car park and so maybe the early leavers knew something I didn’t. The pay on the day park is the last to empty every time and that does seem a little unreasonable, I will likely look to park elsewhere in future as I’m not prepared to wait as long as I did yesterday.
As to the play, I thought we looked genuinely confident with the ball in hand and that must be a good thing. Our entire back line played some excellent running rugby that was a joy to watch. Yes there were mistakes but there must have been a lot with cold hands! Up front it was always going to be thought against a big Bath pack and I thought Underhill was the standout player in the game. We missed Courtney in defending the driving maul which was Bath’s only real weapon and yes there will be some work-ones but I’m happy to take the points and enjoy watching some fine tries on the highlights.

I thought we were excellent in first half until we had the try bonus. Then we switched off.

Surprised no one has highlighted Furbank. He created the space for 2 of first 3 tries. He came into the midfield in both and by standing sufficiently flat he enticed the Bath defenders to rush out of line at him and both times he got beautiful passes out in no time under pressure which created the space and overlaps which we scored from. Plus the beautifully weighted and directed cross field kick for the 6th try. Hands up I didn't particularly see why people were saying he was so good when he first came on the scene but the more I see the more I see real top quality.

I'd see Dingwall and Proctor as first choice centres going forward. We look most cohesive defensively when they play together whilst still offering top attacking threat. For me, Dingwall is the future heart and brains in our midfield like an Anthony Allen at Tigers or Fraser Waters at Wasps.

I also thought Wilkins had a promising game. He made a couple of nice carries and a deft offload.

I enjoyed a lot of the rugby we played - some of the tries were really sharp. Mitch, Freeman, Dingers, Ribeye and Ludlam all particularly good I thought. Defence at times was a bit flimsy - didnt feel like we made bath work that hard for their scores.

I agree with others on the flat atmosphere though. C block seemed quiet and you would barely have known the other stands were there (unusually for the south stand). Hope it is much louder on Friday, when we might need home advantage more. Sure it will be for Sarries...

Yeah the youngsters are starting to reward the coaches for the faith they shiwed in them. Also credit to the coaches for some astute signings that have not cost the bank. Matevesi, Wilkins, Augustus, Skosan, and James have all been great signings.

Quote:

SaintsAsh
Yeah the youngsters are starting to reward the coaches for the faith they shiwed in them. Also credit to the coaches for some astute signings that have not cost the bank. Matevesi, Wilkins, Augustus, Skosan, and James have all been great signings.

+1

Well, taking a few days to digest that performance. It was really an odd game.

Saints never got out of first or second gear, but still were the clearly better team for most of the game.
That continuing trend to switch off and give up a try at halftime has to be fixed. The pack is much better with Augustus at number 8.
Api is still growing on me. He put in a great defensive shift when he came on.

Interesting to see the possession stats from the Saints. Apparently we only had 41% conceded 15 penalties
Did quite well to win by so many. 😁

Quote:

Chris Hoddle
Interesting to see the possession stats from the Saints. Apparently we only had 41% conceded 15 penalties
Did quite well to win by so many. 😁

Doesnt surprise me. We tended to score quite quickly when we had possession. Bath huffed and puffed a lot in comparison with their possession. They seemed to have the ball a lot in the 2nd half.

Quote:

Saint Maul

Quote:

Chris Hoddle
Interesting to see the possession stats from the Saints. Apparently we only had 41% conceded 15 penalties
Did quite well to win by so many. 😁

Doesnt surprise me. We tended to score quite quickly when we had possession. Bath huffed and puffed a lot in comparison with their possession. They seemed to have the ball a lot in the 2nd half.

Quite a lot of their possession time was arguably when there 9 had the ball in his hands and the forwards were having team meetings discussing which pub and or chippy they were going to stop at on the way home

Quote:

Dragonboy

Quote:

Saint Maul

Quote:

Chris Hoddle
Interesting to see the possession stats from the Saints. Apparently we only had 41% conceded 15 penalties
Did quite well to win by so many. 😁

Doesnt surprise me. We tended to score quite quickly when we had possession. Bath huffed and puffed a lot in comparison with their possession. They seemed to have the ball a lot in the 2nd half.

Quite a lot of their possession time was arguably when there 9 had the ball in his hands and the forwards were having team meetings discussing which pub and or chippy they were going to stop at on the way home

Now that made me laugh!