Saints v Newcastle 17th October 2025 - Teams up

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2025:10:23:11:34:18 by Saint Ted.

Cracking team

Fantastic news Freeman is back so the back 3 looks solid and we have the magician Belleau to weave his magic from the bench. Hopefully the 6/2 bench split doesn’t bite us and Freeman doesn’t have an early recurrence of his hip pointer.

Really pleased we have gone strong as Newcastle have been a bogey team. The only player rested looks like Pearson.

Slightly surprised Pollock is on the bench and Graham starting given Pollock is a Lion and enhanced England payment core group member. I’m assuming the message is he might be the chosen one but he still needs to earn his starts. His turnover v Tigers shows what he will bring from the bench.

It’s massive credit to our coaches and players how well we functioned in attack v Tigers despite being without Furbank, Freeman, Hendy, Sleightholme and Ramm in that second half. There’s not too many teams in the world that would look that cohesive with so many back 3 players out racking up 3 try bonuses from the first three games. COYS!!!

. Hopefully the 6/2 bench split doesn’t bite us and Freeman doesn’t have an early recurrence of his hip pointer.

Could always chuck pollock on the wing if it come to it.

As Graham is coming back from his head injury and a long term injury, I wonder if there are concerns about his ability to last 80 minutes.

Pollock available on the bench protects us from this as we can control how long Graham needs to play... in theory

Great team, looking forward to this one.

Bit surprised that Freeman is available. Could this be a bluff from Dowson with him being announced as unavailable shortly before the game?

Pollock in for Freeman. Would certainly make Dickins think. To be fair it could be Kemeny shifted out there, worst comes to worst. He has Proper wheels for a forward and covered wing for Auz under EJ.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2025:10:16:19:41:27 by Sainttwist.

It's a strong Saints side named for your trip to Kingston Park. For my sins I'm a Gloucester fan living in Newcastle and blog about Red Bulls. I think Fin Smith will want to show Steve Borthwick what he's got as Marcus Smith and George Ford have both started well. Here's my preview for those interested [www.philworld.co.uk]

As Saint Maul posts, Pearson presumably just rested!

Surprised at two locks on the bench, would have thought ASY or Pearson added more versatility.

Quote:

Phil W88
It's a strong Saints side named for your trip to Kingston Park. For my sins I'm a Gloucester fan living in Newcastle and blog about Red Bulls. I think Fin Smith will want to show Steve Borthwick what he's got as Marcus Smith and George Ford have both started well. Here's my preview for those interested [www.philworld.co.uk]

A great preview Phil.

It may well be that with so many backs down Pollock is in the bench for versatility, would be interesting to see!

In an ideal world Chick would get at least a part rest this weekend and Graham may not last the 80, we'll see I suppose.

Smith will definitely want to show the best of himself this weekend.

Coles can cover 6. One of Chick and Graham will need to go the full 80 unless we lose both then Kemeney and Pollock with Coles and the two substitute locks.

Might be a funny ol' weekend for Calum Chick, I should think .. I am sure he'll get generous welcome back from the locals!

We obviously have an embarrassment of riches across the backrow - but not sure about Sam Graham as a 7 but I am sure he'll do great!

Other than that, good to get Newcastle away out of the way early in the season before the howling gales of deepest darkest January!

Surprised Pollock is on the bench. He must be chomping at the bit - fine against last week's opposition, but let him run free from the start this week I'd say.

I also think Todaro - who I think we should be signing up for a 5-10 year contract, to stop a French club nicking him - needs a rest. I felt Pollock tired a bit last season through overplaying and I don't want us to break him. Surely Martin or could fill in? But in Dowse we trust.

Newcastle have sold out!

Quote:

St. Tim
Newcastle have sold out!

I wouldn't say that, most clubs would welcome a sponsorship deal like Red Bull's* 😝



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2025:10:17:19:13:52 by SaintsDuncan.

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SaintsDuncan

Quote:

St. Tim
Newcastle have sold out!

I wouldn't say that, most clubs would welcome a sponsorship deal like rust if Red Bull's* 😝

I had to read that three times!

Doh, bloody predictive text!

Corrected now

Discovery has a circle of doom. Thoughts?

We seem to be our own downfall with some very stupid penalties and giving Newcastle both distance back up the pitch and confidence.

We need to sort the @#$%& out!

Agreed. I like that we are being more aggressive in defence, but penalties in their half and inability to change approach to stop consecutive pens is just daft

Have we got the most yellows so far this season?

Pleased to see we're learning to use JJ but we also need to use him as a massive decoy.

Does he have a nickname yet?

That was never a penalty ... he just reached in and got the ball ... the lineout came down on him. The referee was on the wrong side to see. I suspect that the nonsense idea from BBC Noddy that this should be close "for the game" is getting to the ref. There is no whistle for hands in, yet hands slow every ruck from the Saints. Very poor.

Similarly, Williams clearly didn't release. Should never have been a penalty.

I think we'll get the win but not as easily as some have predicted. Newcastle will want a reaction after the Sale match and we've not helped ourselves.

Of their tries, the maul may only have been due to being a massive man up in forwards and the crossfield kick to Litchfield may have been caught if we had a genuine winger.

Positive outlook



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2025:10:17:20:44:04 by St Stokey..

So glad we haven't got a DJ, that noise is awful.

Thankfully for Newcastle, the only worse decision maker than the Saints players is Tempest. A truelly terrible reffing display, should have gone to spec savers.

And I must say, it is not because I feel hard done by. But he is making it a poor game.

Penalty only….

Ever get the feeling that any decision is going to go Newcastle's way?

It is wierd, the first yellow is a team yellow. But you give a second and get a red.

It looked to me that the initial contact was JJ's chest to the Newcastle players shoulder.

Quote:

ramseysaint
It looked to me that the initial contact was JJ's chest to the Newcastle players shoulder.

Yeah, in and of itself a doubtful yellow, and the first was only a yellow because of 5 pens from other players.

5 points is 5 points but Saints aren’t doing my blood pressure any favours! 😂

What can I say ... win against a spoiling team is good. 5 points....

Wot, no injuries? 🤔😄

Glad we went strong on that one
Could have been a banana skin

5 points on the road

But I wouldn’t be surprised if falcons start winning a few

It was never a red card

Coles just gets better

Job done, 5 pts and we move. Defensive aggression was really really impressive today- so destructive and shut them out time after time. When we conceded it wasn’t really system errors more just men down or unlucky drop etc.

I have to say, Robbie Smith was brilliant when he was on and Wright stepped up to replace him. All over the place, smashing everything and spoiling ball.

Mitch, Coles, Chicky and Trev very good too.

Going to have to be a lot better next week

Newcastle will get better as the money kicks in, so good to get a 5 pointer up there before that happens and the permafrost sets in up there!

Job done - some things to work on e.g. penalty count.

18 points from 4 games, 2 wins on the road, bonus points in every game. Good start to the season.

But blimey they’ve all been tough watches!!

Coles was immense, I keep banging the drum but I thought Manny off the bench was huge, in fact the whole bench front-row impressed me. Mitchell absolutely class too. Sarries next week will be another step up.

I didn't think the back line functioned as well as we've seen. Fin seemed to get swamped a lot and was having to adjust on the fly. As a result, Dingwall didn't seem to get much decent ball.

Hutchinson still having the season of his life and is masquerading as back row.

It is a good start, we are a team that seems to be better at the end of season when we have time together to get so 18 points after 3 games is a good return.

Will JJ get a ban?

Quote:

Saint dolph
Will JJ get a ban?

May do … but shouldn’t. Rugby is about all sizes, if that was a yellow then nobody should select players over 6 foot in case they aren’t quick enough to bend over into a tackle … seriously this needs some deeper thought about how taller players are apparently meant to ‘tackle’ smaller players, ridiculous.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2025:10:17:22:32:44 by AlexC.

Quote:

AlexC

Quote:

Saint dolph
Will JJ get a ban?

May do … but shouldn’t. Rugby is about all sizes, if that was a yellow then nobody should select players over 6 foot in case they aren’t quick enough to bend over into a tackle … seriously this needs some deeper thought about how taller players are apparently meant to ‘tackle’ smaller players, ridiculous.

Especially if the smaller man just dropped a couple of feet going into the tackle. He bent, he wrapped and he didn't drive into the tackle. Thats a penalty in my view.

Quote:

SaintsAsh
18 points after 3 games is a good return.

Certainly would be

Can some one explain JJ’s lineout yellow?
Jumping across was the call

He didn’t jump.
He put his arm across and was onside.
A one eyed saints fan view or a valid penalty?

Quote:

lost in duston
Can some one explain JJ’s lineout yellow?
Jumping across was the call

He didn’t jump.
He put his arm across and was onside.
A one eyed saints fan view or a valid penalty?

Not one-eyed - when viewed from my Saints eye!

I said exactly the same thing at the time. He was allowed to pass through a huge hole in the Newcastle set, and wallop! Either the law was applied incorrectly or the law is an ass!

I was sat directly above it. It looked a terrible decision to me. He grabbed the ball off the Newcastle guy after he had landed.
JJ doesn’t jump!

Sometimes the win is more important than the performance. 18 points with a home game before the autumn international break places us in a strong position. The first 5 game draw has been kind to us. But we will need to improve when we start facing the likes of Bath and Sale. Last season we failed to pick up bonus points, whereas this season we have. Whilst we haven’t been completely convincing in any game so far that won’t matter at the end of the season if we continue to rack up points as long as we start to iron out the areas not working so well.

We are top for dominant tackles with JJ a huge part but our commitment and work off the ball for the 30 mins he was off was a huge part in why we won. The Newcastle 5m scrum from our line we absolutely melted was a beautiful display of power. I thought our half back game management was the difference such as Fin pinning them for lineouts deep in their 22.

Work ons:
- offside penalties and discipline with cheap penalties are killing us. Something is needed as the message isn’t getting through. We won’t get far in Europe if this isn’t addressed by then.
- breakdown - did we get any turnovers? You know it’s bad when the biggest jackal threat is a Newcastle winger (Williams). The selection of Graham with Pollock on the bench was a strange one and didn’t work.
- our error-rate. Our ability to turn it on in a few key moments is getting us out of jail but things like the little pop passes from forwards to Fin Smith bouncing rather than finding him - which also happened v Tigers.
- lineout errors on our own ball again. We miss Langdon’s accuracy.
- also can we practice surrounding players racing to where a couple of players have initially held up a the opposition player with the ball with a held up maul promising. We had a gold-lined example in the second half and surrounding Saints players just watched allowing Newcastle to pile players in and got it to ground and regained possession. I’ve seen Saints squander this massive opportunity to turnover possession on a few occasions. Ireland are masters at this and it’s an easy win we are failing to exploit.
- in 3 of the 4 games we have taken our foot off the gas after building a lead..I’ve said it before that we look like a team that would benefit from the input of a psychologist.

Hopefully we can be like the Dallaglio-era Wasps and whilst not completely convincing early season as the season progresses we improve and peak at the end. We were too close for comfort to losing that game last night so whilst 18 points is fantastic, we do need to improve with tougher upcoming fixtures.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2025:10:18:09:39:34 by Saint Maul.

Saints' Second Row: Depth is HERE. 💚🖤
​For the last few seasons, our forward depth (especially in the second row) has been a real worry. That's changing fast. We now look four deep with quality—and that's without seeing Munga play yet!
​Massive shout out to the coaches for developing Lockett. And whoever moved Prowse to second row... take a bow! 👏
​The strategy seems to be a deliberate, French-style move for a BIG tighthead second row with JJ and Prowse. I'm loving the early returns this season!

Quote:

twsaint
I was sat directly above it. It looked a terrible decision to me. He grabbed the ball off the Newcastle guy after he had landed.
JJ doesn’t jump!

I was watching on TV and couldn’t see any infringement at the time. I’ve also played the line out back several times ( the highlights are now on YouTube) and still can’t see what offence was supposedly committed.

I’m far from being up on all the laws but would be interested to know if anyone has got a better understanding of why the ref deemed it a penalty.

Also, it grinds my gears that refs choose to enforce some laws to the absolute letter, yet play fast and loose with others. For example last night Tempest was very insistent that either Smith or Wright (can’t remember who was on the pitch at the time) took the lineout at exactly the right place, virtually to the inch, yet was quite happy to allow put-ins into the scrum, by both teams, to go straight to the back row.

Fortunately those in France value the scrum as being something which is an integral part of the game and that it should be fairly contested. Regardless of what is being allowed by the rest of the World in an effort to protect it they are now refereeing the scrum correctly. It can only be hoped that other countries follow suit, although it’s unlikely on this side of the Channel as the RFU/PRL clearly believe that it’s more important to knock off a few letters from the word ‘Premiership’

Quote:

FatAlan
Wot, no injuries? 🤔😄

The real victory and outcome we all wanted!

Quote:

chappers_saint

Quote:

FatAlan
Wot, no injuries? 🤔😄

The real victory and outcome we all wanted!

Didn't Kemeny go off injured?

When our defensive scrum melted theirs, how did Robbie Smith manage to exit the scrum through their channel and seize the lose ball?

Quote:

Saint Robert

Quote:

chappers_saint

Quote:

FatAlan
Wot, no injuries? 🤔😄

The real victory and outcome we all wanted!

Didn't Kemeny go off injured?

Don’t spoil it 😂

I dont know how we smashed their scrum and didn't win a penalty.

As for JJ, clearly he doesnt jump, I did wonder if he moved too quickly and made contact before the jumper landed.

Some harsh calls from Tempest. Perhaps the incessant music put him off.

A good call from Dowse and the coaching team during the 20 min red.
Bulking up the pack with Prowse by taking off a back is not a usual call, but was a smart move last night.

Thought you were going to run away with it with the two early tries, your backs looked to be at their fluid best. You couldn't kill the game and the yellow allowed Red Bulls back in.

Re the Kingston Park experience, it's certainly an improvement but even as someone coming towards my late thirties I think I'm too old for the Red Bull demographic! Here's my thoughts [www.philworld.co.uk]

I’d imagine the yellow for JJ’s first card was for an accumulation of team penalties.

Quote:

Awaywin
I’d imagine the yellow for JJ’s first card was for an accumulation of team penalties.

I don't think so - the ref was clear that JJ "had jumped across" on his ref-mike. And yet from the touchline camera, that did appear to be in a perfect position, it did not appear that JJ jumped at all. He stepped into a hole left by the Newcastle front lifter and wrapped up the jumper and ball.

Hey ho. Another for the bloopers' reel!

Tempest had already penalised JJ once for jumping across prior to the yellow ‘offence’.

The yellow was almost certainly for accumulation, as Tempest had already warned Callum.

Whether it was a penalty is debatable!

So we finish the weekend top as the only unbeaten side. Squeaky bum in every match. Early days.

Quote:

Santiago
So we finish the weekend top as the only unbeaten side. Squeaky bum in every match. Early days.

Having played Exeter, Gloucester, Leicester and Newcastle, I think we have played the most unsettled teams so far … not to undersell those games though. Saracens will be the real barometer next week to see where our ambition and ability lies this season … fingers crossed for a good and successful match :-)

100% agree! We’ve not played the strongest of sides yet. If we win against Saracend Friday night, I think we will be in the mix!

It’s so important to not just to make the play offs, but to secure a home play off which is essential! 😇🤞🤞🤞

It’s great to see Saints at top of the table with almost a quarter of the season already gone ( yes I know that’s ridiculous in itself ! ) but we are still conceding too many tries and finding it difficult to achieve a full eighty minute performance. Friday night will be a huge test but one I believe this side is fully capable of passing.